sfgdood
Long time member
stats geeks never played the game...that's why they don't get it and never will
Posts: 90
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Post by sfgdood on Jul 17, 2015 21:34:48 GMT -5
If the Giants are going to stay in the race, it would behoove them to make hay before August because the schedule becomes much more challenging next month. Right now we're in AZ, then we go to SD before coming home to face Oakland and Milwaukee. Then we hit the road to face the Rangers and after that it gets tougher. At Atlanta and Chicago...Houston and Washington at home...back on the road in Pit and StL...and then the Cubs and Cards again at home.
The next couple of weeks are pivotal, I would say.
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Post by Islandboagie on Jul 18, 2015 3:22:08 GMT -5
I wonder if the time is now for the Giants to make Blanco the starter in CF. I can't watch Pagan misplay another ball off the CF fence, it's becoming common place. Blanco would probably catch most of those balls on the fly.
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Post by klaiggeb on Jul 18, 2015 9:58:21 GMT -5
THANK YOU, Boagie, THANK YOU~!!!!!!!!
I was irate with him for giving up on both of them!
Those were catchable balls!
Both!
I was beginning to doubt my own eyes!
He pulled up in fear of hitting that PADDED wall.
Heck, both balls hit at the base!
Terrible defense on his part!
You and Randy are both right: The time IS now to make a move, AND to do as you suggested; Make Blanco the CF!
But that is not going to happen. Bochy is welded to Pagan as his CF.
I said weeks ago that Pagan needed to be replaced, and watching him SLAP at balls... again last night, coupled with his two screw ups in CF has more than convinced me he needs to sit in favor of Blanco: who, by the way, went into last night's game with a .380 OBP as opposed to Pagan's .302.
Pagan has been swinging the bat all year long like an OLD 34 year old.
We're lucky to have pulled that one off last night.
boly
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Post by Islandboagie on Jul 18, 2015 11:43:13 GMT -5
Even Bochy has his breaking point. It was hard to get Aaron Rowand out of CF too, but it did happen eventually. Blanco has earned the opportunity and I guarantee you Bochy sees the same things we do, if it continues it will happen.
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Post by rxmeister on Jul 18, 2015 16:23:24 GMT -5
Pagan no and Blanco no. Go out and get Carlos Gomez! Brewers have made him available.
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Post by klaiggeb on Jul 18, 2015 16:52:03 GMT -5
Mark, I'm more than a little leery of Gomez.
I've seen him brood after a bad at bat much too often.
Besides, HE wants to hit one hole... and Aoki is much better than.
boly
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sfgdood
Long time member
stats geeks never played the game...that's why they don't get it and never will
Posts: 90
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Post by sfgdood on Jul 18, 2015 17:18:28 GMT -5
I love the talent Gomez has, both offensively and with the glove. Whether his attitude could be a problem, that is what you pay scouts to determine. I will say sometimes a guy can become more of a team player when there are team leaders with rings on their fingers to keep him in line.
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Post by klaiggeb on Jul 19, 2015 11:12:40 GMT -5
You could be right, Randy, you could be very right.
I just don't see him fitting in.
I get the sence that Pence has a way of keeping people with questionable attitdues in line.
And as you've so aptly pointed out, Posey is a really solid leader.
I get the impression that the quiet guy we see on the screen in interviews... is just his Bull Durham personality.
"Just taking it one game at a time..."
That, behind the scenes, he's more vocal, picking the right moments to speak up. And I also get the sense that his words carry plenty of weight!
boly
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Post by Islandboagie on Jul 19, 2015 11:47:46 GMT -5
Very true, Randy. But is it worth the risk for the Giants to take on that project? 8 homeruns this year so far while playing his home games at Miller park tells me no. Matt Duffy has the same amount while playing his home games at the hardest park to hit homeruns in, and you deemed him "not ready" for the major league level.
I don't know that much about Gomez's clubhouse demeanor, his problem seems to be in controlling his anger on the field, which tells me winning is not his biggest concern even when he's suited up.
Don't get me wrong though, I think the Giants could benefit from acquiring a center fielder, but in my opinion a solid late inning reliever would be much more beneficial. And I highly doubt they'll manage to land both.
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Post by rxmeister on Jul 19, 2015 12:13:25 GMT -5
Gomez has had some terrible luck with injuries this year, and his toughness has actually made it worse. He had a hamstring issue that he kept tweaking because he tried to come back too soon, and other minor things that have kept him from being the player he is. What really won me over was when he was hit by a pitch, supposed to be out for a week, then came right back the next day and hit a three run HR in his first at bat. And unlike Gerardo Parra he's not an FA after the season and the Giants would have another year of control. I know the Mets want him and they certainly have the better prospects, but I'd really love to get the guy.
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sfgdood
Long time member
stats geeks never played the game...that's why they don't get it and never will
Posts: 90
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Post by sfgdood on Jul 19, 2015 12:32:28 GMT -5
Are you going to throw that Duffy thing in my face forever, Boagie? You sound like that douchebag Rog now, beating a horse that not only is dead, it's decomposing. People a lot more knowledgeable than me were "wrong" about whether Matt was ready, including the Giants themselves. They had Matt ticketed for AAA prior to Spring Training and didn't really see him as a 3rd baseman.
Carlos Gomez is hardly a project. The last 3 years he's averaging over 20 bombs and 35 steals. He's having a bit of a down year but it appears he missed much of April and more games in June. I don't know what the injury was but even taking that into consideration, his power has still been there when healthy. He's a very good defender. He's a young vet with a lot of talent. I don't know what we'd need to give up for him but I'm far less confident in the arms in the system so I wouldn't be opposed to giving up one of them.
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Post by Islandboagie on Jul 19, 2015 13:31:24 GMT -5
Randy- Are you going to throw that Duffy thing in my face forever, Boagie?
Boagie- Pretty much, yea.
As for Gomez, I'm not questioning his talent, I'm questioning if the risk is worth the reward. And thank you both for pointing out that he's also injury prone.
I'll pass on Gomez. I'm pretty sure the Giants would be making a mistake by giving up a significant amount for him, and that's what the Brewers would want.
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Post by rxmeister on Jul 19, 2015 14:22:21 GMT -5
Had over 600 plate appearances in 2013 and 2014. In fact he had almost 700 last year. Injury prone? Hardly.
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Post by klaiggeb on Jul 19, 2015 20:05:16 GMT -5
I'm going to jump in on boagie's side here; not the injury bit, the other "stuff."
like taking his anger at bad at bats on the field.
No question about his talent. Not at all.
His head. That has been, and continues to be my problem with him.
boly
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Post by Islandboagie on Jul 19, 2015 22:59:55 GMT -5
The Dodgers keep winning. The Pirates, Cubs and Mets are making strong runs for a Wild Card spot along with us. The Mets and Cubs don't have any problem adding a big contract or two. I don't think we can go through the trade deadline without making a big move this time.
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Post by klaiggeb on Jul 20, 2015 11:10:05 GMT -5
I agree with you, boagie; totally.
Thing is... what "big move" could we/do we make?
You've mentioned before that a 'bat' wouldn't be your first priority... and after a LOT of thought, I agree with you.
Bullpen is what you suggested, and I'm on board that train right along side of you.
Want to make a big impact move, Bobby?
Go get Aroldis Chapman of the Reds.
THAT would be an impact move.
Problem is, boagie, who/what would we have to give up?
Young arms for sure, and IF my memory is correct, Chapman is not a free agent at the end of this year.
But here's the problem; we have the OLDEST starting staff in the majors.
We have some young kids who aren't that far away... Beede, Mella, Mejia and Okert.
IF we move a couple of our top arms... we're screwed for the next bunch of years as we are going to be DESPERATE to replace at least two of our starters next year.
To make an impact deal... who goes?
For ME...I see Arroyo and Crick and ONEof the group mentioned above, but I'm not sure the Reds would agree.
We'll see, but you ARE, IMHO, correct on 2 points:
1-We need to make an impact deal (but I'm betting we won't)
2-We need help in the bullpen.
boly
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Post by rxmeister on Jul 20, 2015 12:11:13 GMT -5
That's some good thinking, Boly. Arroyo has value and the Giants infield will have no openings for quite some time. Maybe the best infield in baseball and all young. Crick still has value and Adam Duvall hit two more bombs yesterday. The Giants are looking at outfielders, but reliever has become a priority. And the bullpen is just good and deep enough that it needs a top of the line closer, not another seventh or eighth inning guy.
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Post by klaiggeb on Jul 20, 2015 16:12:44 GMT -5
I understood the reason behind drafting Arroyo... but we don't have a spot for him now that Duffy and Panik have emerged.
Glad you agreed with my thinking, Mark, because to me, Arroyo will be wasted in our system, to he would have pretty decent value, to very good value to most others.
boly
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sfgdood
Long time member
stats geeks never played the game...that's why they don't get it and never will
Posts: 90
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Post by sfgdood on Jul 20, 2015 20:10:24 GMT -5
I think the same could be said of the signing of Lucius Fox...but Fox' ceiling is much higher, I do believe
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Post by klaiggeb on Jul 21, 2015 10:05:51 GMT -5
Agree, Randy. I'd forgotten about him.
For ME... it would be a "no brainer" to include BOTH of them in an impact deal. And right now, the BEST impact deal I can think of would be for Aroldis Chapman.
boly
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sfgdood
Long time member
stats geeks never played the game...that's why they don't get it and never will
Posts: 90
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Post by sfgdood on Jul 21, 2015 12:05:11 GMT -5
Fox is NOT going to be traded. They'll find a spot for him. They see him as a 5 tool player, which is why they opened the vault for him.
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Post by Islandboagie on Jul 21, 2015 13:24:22 GMT -5
Randy is right, Fox isn't going anywhere. He's an A+ prospect and you wouldn't get nearly the value back that he'd be worth in a year or two. It would be like selling your $10 lottery ticket for $20, if that lottery ticket had a good chance of winning.
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Post by Islandboagie on Jul 21, 2015 20:15:23 GMT -5
I'm still on board with getting Chapman if the price is right. Use him as a reliever this year, then next year turn around and make him a starter.
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Post by Rog on Jul 23, 2015 23:18:15 GMT -5
Pagan no and Blanco no. Go out and get Carlos Gomez! Brewers have made him available. Rog -- If the Giants can afford to give up the prospects, acquiring Gomez would be a coup. He's affordable ($9.0 million next season, $8.0 this year), is under control for a season and a third and is still a good player. To top it off, he's a right-handed hitter who can defend. Read more: sfgiantsmessageboard.proboards.com/thread/2931/time#ixzz3gmMKwU6A
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Post by Rog on Jul 23, 2015 23:20:31 GMT -5
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Post by Rog on Jul 23, 2015 23:21:42 GMT -5
Fox is NOT going to be traded.
Rog -- Other than as a player to be name MUCH later, Fox can't be traded for a year, can he? Fox wasn't a bad signing for a team that isn't serious about the international market.
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Post by Islandboagie on Jul 27, 2015 23:58:47 GMT -5
And tonight is precisely why I wouldn't be interested in Gomez. He's an idiot.
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Post by rxmeister on Jul 28, 2015 8:00:25 GMT -5
I wouldn't sour on the guy for one stupid immature move. Maybe SF is the perfect spot to straighten him out. Giants are on fire, hopefully that doesn't delude them into thinking they can stand pat. I don't think it will. By the way, Rog, I think international rules are different so Fox CAN be traded. Evans said everyone asks for him in trades, so that has to be the case. I'm reading rumors about Hamels, Price, Samardzija, Morse (?), and Chapman, so I'm pretty sure the Giants know an upgrade is needed.
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Post by Islandboagie on Jul 28, 2015 10:18:26 GMT -5
Mark- I wouldn't sour on the guy for one stupid immature move. Maybe SF is the perfect spot to straighten him out.
Boagie- One stupid move? Do you even know who Carlos Gomez is? This is just one of many stupid immature acts by Gomez.
You're usually right on point with your comments, Mark, but this time I just can't agree. Giving up multiple prospects and paying the rest of his contract is not worth taking the chance on a "maybe."
Hell, MAYBE Pagan and Blanco combine for more production in CF than Gomez from this point forward. A "Maybe" is not worth giving up Susac and a pitcher. We already have plenty of maybes as is. If the Giants make a move it has to be for close to a guarantee. Otherwise, don't make a move.
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sfgdood
Long time member
stats geeks never played the game...that's why they don't get it and never will
Posts: 90
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Post by sfgdood on Jul 28, 2015 13:01:46 GMT -5
I expect Hamels to be going to Chicago, especially after he no-hit them. That is the only pitcher I would have been interested in because he has years on his deal. I don't want to give up top prospects (ESPECIALLY not Susac who we will need when the decision is made to move Posey to the infield) for strictly a rental player. I would actually be shocked if the Giants make a move other than some minor tinkering. If things begin to go south again in August, they could try to pick someone off the waiver wire. It's possible that Blanco finally has earned the CF spot beyond this season so a trade for Gomez could be moot at this point. As for Fox, I think it would be a monumental gaffe to trade him so quickly. We need to confirm how good he can be before we just give him up lickety split.
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