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Post by reedonly on Aug 28, 2023 19:50:37 GMT -5
I like that second one a lot, Reed. I remember Rog mentioning luck in 2012 when the Giants won the division, then went on to sweep the Tigers in the World Series. I didn't agree with the assessment that somehow good luck had to do with them winning the Championship then, just like I can't blame the Giants poor play on bad luck now. Yes, odd occurrences happen, sometimes it benefits a team, sometimes it doesn't. I feel that throughout a full baseball season it tends to even out. Just like getting calls that are for you or go against you also even out. It's the teams that make the most of those opportunities that play deep into October. Rog seemed like an apologist for the Dodgers and for analytics. I didn't need him to "educate" me.
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Post by reedonly on Aug 28, 2023 20:07:10 GMT -5
I agree, it certainly looks like they try to appease everyone. Unfortunately, in the bay area that's probably a good business practice. Well, it started when they were trying to win votes to get the ballpark approved so they had to pander to one group to raise money for them. Later on, they had to pander to more groups to win necessary votes for Mission Rock. The loudest ethnic/sexual groups get the most press and the most airtime and other groups are treated less than the louder groups. If they want to be players in signing Asian players, they need to pay attention to the Asian fanbase or else all they are going to get are guys like Yabu or Aoki. Unfortunately, Baer and the Giants will continue what they're doing because that is who they are and that's the way they roll. They probably are not aware of what they do and don't do and they should not waste their time trying to sign Ohtani. He is going to be polite, go through the motions, and look like he will sign but if Baer and FZ are the lead dogs in the hunt, Ohtani will know better.
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Post by reedonly on Aug 28, 2023 20:29:49 GMT -5
In my opinion Asians really aren't what people would consider as "marginalized" in the bay area. I'm not even really sure Asians are what we should consider a minority in the bay area anymore. I grew up in Sunnyvale and Los Altos hills, two of the more upscale areas in the bay. I remember going to school with many Asians, but not many Black or Hispanic kids. This was back in the 80's, the Asian population has only grown since then. Also, the Asians I know don't want to be treated as a minority, or a marginalized race. They believe in hard work and don't expect help or handouts...so I think any suggestion that they need special treatment doesn't really have the same reaction that you get from other races. During and after the pandemic, there have been a lot of Asian hate incidents in San Francisco, including one where my co-worker's mother was stabbed. Giants and Kapler made a lot of noise the year before (including national anthem antics) but hardly a peep out of them regarding Asian hate crimes. The Asian hate crimes do not fit their narrative.
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Post by reedonly on Aug 28, 2023 20:33:08 GMT -5
Boly: Frankly, I LOVED Thairo's speech to the team; reminiscent of Hunter Pence only without the animation.
Also, really loved the aggressive play everywhere yesterday.
LONG over due.
Then again, that goes back to my statement above about insanity.
We DON'T steal bases, and we have a couple of guys who can.
We DON'T bunt and worst, we DON'T hit and run.
Kapler doesn't like to do those things which, IMHO, makes him a narrow minded leader.
Which again, goes back to my statement about insanity.
Estrada's speech is way overdue but if they have to rely on Thairo to motivate them, that means the manager is not doing a good job.
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Post by Islandboagie on Aug 28, 2023 21:23:24 GMT -5
Reed- During and after the pandemic, there have been a lot of Asian hate incidents in San Francisco, including one where my co-worker's mother was stabbed. Giants and Kapler made a lot of noise the year before (including national anthem antics) but hardly a peep out of them regarding Asian hate crimes. The Asian hate crimes do not fit their narrative.
Boagie- I agree again. The Asian hate crimes should've gotten much more attention. Kapler and the Giants are just followers of narratives, they weren't going to say anything.
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Post by reedonly on Aug 29, 2023 8:25:54 GMT -5
Reed- During and after the pandemic, there have been a lot of Asian hate incidents in San Francisco, including one where my co-worker's mother was stabbed. Giants and Kapler made a lot of noise the year before (including national anthem antics) but hardly a peep out of them regarding Asian hate crimes. The Asian hate crimes do not fit their narrative. Boagie- I agree again. The Asian hate crimes should've gotten much more attention. Kapler and the Giants are just followers of narratives, they weren't going to say anything. There are two demographics the Giants and Kapler pay attention to and the rest are just "me too", even though one of the two groups is the one performing most of the hate crimes. Circling back to the Correa thing, I just wanted to point out that Correa was probably not a quota hire in the sense that Alyssa Nyken was. His race is a bonus because it makes them look more diverse but generally, the Giants usually ignore Asians. Correa is the "mini-me" to Kapler and FZ. He seems to be the one in charge of positioning, conditioning, and infield defense, three big problem areas. if I were in charge, he would be looking for another job.
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Post by klaiggeb on Aug 29, 2023 8:34:01 GMT -5
Mini-me!
What a great monitor to give him! I plan on using that a lot, no check that, I plan on stealing that from you a lot:-)
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Post by reedonly on Aug 29, 2023 8:39:42 GMT -5
I like that second one a lot, Reed. I remember Rog mentioning luck in 2012 when the Giants won the division, then went on to sweep the Tigers in the World Series. I didn't agree with the assessment that somehow good luck had to do with them winning the Championship then, just like I can't blame the Giants poor play on bad luck now. Yes, odd occurrences happen, sometimes it benefits a team, sometimes it doesn't. I feel that throughout a full baseball season it tends to even out. Just like getting calls that are for you or go against you also even out. It's the teams that make the most of those opportunities that play deep into October. Well, the Dodgers lost most of their starting rotation to injury and have opened up a 13.5 game lead over the Giants. The way the Giants reacted was with lethargic and unfocused baseball and "we'll get better when Yaz,Conforto, or fill in the blank comes back." Dodgers stepped up and Giants squandered their chance.
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Post by klaiggeb on Aug 29, 2023 9:21:17 GMT -5
Mini-me! What a great monitor to give him! I plan on using that a lot, no check that, I plan on stealing that from you a lot:-) Not MONITOR, moniker! Sheesh!
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Post by klaiggeb on Aug 29, 2023 9:22:46 GMT -5
You nailed it!
On the interview I think it was with Bailey, he basically said the same thing; that they needed to wake up call because they kind of woke up each day sort of expecting to lose.
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Post by reedonly on Aug 29, 2023 9:41:24 GMT -5
Well my question is... Are we the baddies? I am not a fan of ownership, current management team, and I could deal without half of these players. I am a big fan of Mays, McCovey, Marichal, and championship era teams and I'm not sure the current group feels like they are carrying on the legacy. Sometimes, I wonder. Its not even like the Giants are their own entity anymore. The Giant are now a big corporation that has outgrown the team itself. When you refer to the Giants as a business entity, it also includes the Mission Rock Development, the ballpark, and the brand, in addition to the team on the field. One curious thing is that when you look at the Giants' mission statement, it doesn't mention anything about winning. The highlighted key words are words like "Inclusion, diversity, caring, excellence, fun, integrity, innovation, and respect". The fans care about winning but ownership is more about profits. The Mission Rock Project is a huge deal. They are going to invest $1.6 billion to develop it and it is expected to generate $900 Million per year in property tax and $700 million per year for schools, not to mention 10000 permanent jobs. They are not giving details about potential profits but if they are investing that kind of money, they are probably expecting huge profits, probably on the order of what the Chase Center is generating now. It might be more accurate to think of the Giants as a property management and development group more than as a baseball team. Whether or not the Giants pocket the profits or spend like the Warriors is another matter entirely but I think I have an idea about what they are going to do.
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Post by klaiggeb on Aug 29, 2023 12:40:50 GMT -5
Winning is NOT in the mission statement?
That is incredibly sad!
Yes, any companies' job is to make a profit; that goes without saying.
But a SPORTS TEAM HAS to be about winning!
Has to!
And I'm with you, Reed.
1-I am not a fan of our leadership in ALL capacities, from Baer, to FZ to Kapler.
2-I, too, am a huge fan of Marichal, Mays, McCovey, Cepeda, Hart, Thompson, W. Clark and so many many others!
3-I have no time for woke players or concepts or philosophies on the team. That's political stuff and has NO BUSINESS being part of decision making or in the club house.
As I've said multiple times over the years; a good portion of modern day players absolutely disgust me.
I remember how the game used to be... but isn't any more.
And when I read stuff like you posted... and when I hear woke nonsense for Slater and others... my heart breaks a little more each time.
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Post by Islandboagie on Aug 29, 2023 13:25:27 GMT -5
We don't have to look back that far to see when baseball was just baseball..Even just back to the Bochy years, there was no political posturing or silly protests. They were concerned about winning Championships.
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Post by reedonly on Aug 29, 2023 13:56:48 GMT -5
My bad: I got so disgusted with the value statement that I missed the Mission Statement. However, I think all the stuff in the value statement are things that should be understood and do not need to be said. Reminds me of a commencement ceremony, for SFSU I went to a few years back. They kept sprinkling in the words "inclusion" and "diveristy" and made sure to say AOC and Pelosi's name every now and then (Pelosi was commcement speaker) but what is sad was over half of those kids probably ended up under-employed or un-employed and stuck with student loans. Value statement is verbal diarrhea.
MISSION STATEMENT We strive to be champions on and off the field.
Nos esforzamos por ser campeones dentro y fuera del terreno de juego.
VALUE STATEMENTS We are one team, built on mutual respect and driven by these shared values: We embrace our responsibility to lift our community. We unleash our collective power by fostering inclusion and embracing diversity of background and thought. We believe that by caring deeply, we bring out the best in each other. We lead with integrity and have the courage to stand up for what’s right. We pursue excellence through innovation and iteration, making one thoughtful decision after another. We are in the fun business, making memories and creating connections. We work toward a future in which Giants baseball captures the imagination of all generations.
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Post by reedonly on Aug 29, 2023 14:05:20 GMT -5
My own mission statement would be "World Series Championships or bust" and if you don't understand it, get out. Also, it has to be self-sustainable. If you want all that other stuff, go work at a spa.
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Post by reedonly on Aug 29, 2023 14:21:50 GMT -5
Winning is NOT in the mission statement? That is incredibly sad! Yes, any companies' job is to make a profit; that goes without saying. But a SPORTS TEAM HAS to be about winning! Has to! And I'm with you, Reed. 1-I am not a fan of our leadership in ALL capacities, from Baer, to FZ to Kapler. 2-I, too, am a huge fan of Marichal, Mays, McCovey, Cepeda, Hart, Thompson, W. Clark and so many many others! 3-I have no time for woke players or concepts or philosophies on the team. That's political stuff and has NO BUSINESS being part of decision making or in the club house. As I've said multiple times over the years; a good portion of modern day players absolutely disgust me. I remember how the game used to be... but isn't any more. And when I read stuff like you posted... and when I hear woke nonsense for Slater and others... my heart breaks a little more each time. I am pretty much disgusted whenever I step outside or look at news. Its not just the players, its people everywhere being selfish and rude driving around or on the streets or at the workplace. No one can even tell a joke without it becoming a federal case. Our legacy players led by example, our leaders like Bochy led by example. My wife gets San Francisco Magazine and the guy on the cover of the July/August issue totally disgusted me with the menacing glare, tattoos, expensive haircut and clothing. I said to myself this is the kind of person who represents the worst of San Francisco and the kind of d-bag I would avoid dealing with at all costs. In small white print on that cover were the words "San Francisco manager Gabe Kapler".
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Post by klaiggeb on Aug 29, 2023 16:07:14 GMT -5
Perfect! Egotistical ego so hung up and woke he has no idea what truth and honesty are, much less honor
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Post by pachyderm on Aug 29, 2023 17:47:03 GMT -5
2 game win streak...
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Post by klaiggeb on Aug 29, 2023 18:56:47 GMT -5
Double the consecutive wins we've had for the last month! :-)
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Post by reedonly on Sept 13, 2023 9:51:56 GMT -5
Correa played and coached for a Division 3 college. He went from that to a job with the Indians, how does that happen? I'm not saying Correa doesn't know anything, but that big of a jump didn't happen because he was the most qualified, he obviously knew the right person, or they needed to fill their minority quota..or perhaps a little of both. And now a few years later he's essentially the #2 guy in the dugout, saddled up next to Kapler every game. We got Championship trophy cases in the lobby, this ain't a division 3 college and it's not the Indians either. It's like taking a McDonald's fry cook and making him the kitchen manager of a michelin star restaurant. Manaea got a couple of double play grounders yesterday that out got one out because of positioning of Estrada. Supposedly, that went against the data (historically, Naylor was more likely to get the line drive instead of the grounder). Where is the common sense? With all the talk about improving the fielding before the season, they've reached 100 errors. One good thing is that Manaea seems to have fixed himself enough that he might be tempted to opt out and test free agency.
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Post by klaiggeb on Sept 13, 2023 10:16:42 GMT -5
Rarely do you see OTHER teams beout of position like that. Twice!!
Changed the whole game.
Manaea pitched well enough to get another start, that's for sure!
But my question is. WHY CAN'T OUR HITTERS STAY IN THE STRIKE ZONE? Seems they all came to the ballpark with a case of the stupids!
I literally lost track of all the times our hitters chased bad pitches early in the counts, and made outs. And their guy was struggling to throw strikes!
After four games that were really good, or at least pretty good, all of a sudden these guys reverted back to hard to watch.
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Post by reedonly on Sept 14, 2023 9:20:42 GMT -5
Boly: Rarely do you see OTHER teams be out of position like that. Twice!!
Positioning is a Kai Correa thing.
By the way, before they won five of the last six, Kapler had Ron Wotus come into the clubhouse to give them a speech. He asked the players to raise their hands if they thought they were still in it (all players raise their hands and everyone is looking at each other). Then, he said that teams work hard to get into the position they are in so they need to push on. Pretty simple thing but its something Kapler should have done a couple of months ago.
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