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Post by klaiggeb on Aug 11, 2022 10:16:19 GMT -5
I will admit, there is plenty of blame to go around for this season... plenty of blame.
Yes, there have been tons of injuries to starters, but those who have gotten to play a lot have simply under performed at monumental levels.
Topping that list for me is one of my favorites; Yaz. He has been awful!
I said last year and I'll say it again; I believe his problems at the plate are vision related. IMHO, he has missed HUNDREDS of fastballs right down the heart of the strike zone and the ONLY reason I can have for that is he's not seeing spin; that's a vision problem.
But IMHO, the debacle that this team has become; the debacle that the bullpen is and has been all season long rest squarely in the over confident, arrogant, deceitful lap of Farhan.
1-He totally ignored the history of older players who SUDDENLY
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Post by klaiggeb on Aug 11, 2022 10:33:20 GMT -5
and inexplicably have career years; they DON'T follow them up with even decent ones.
Solano after his 2020 season, this past year, Crawford and Belt, and Webb.
By ignoring history, he repeated it.
2-He ignored the track records of players who have not had decent careers; Leone, Little, and Alvarez just to name a few.
3-I stand by what I have said from day one; Farhan was, is and continues to be deceitful to the fans and ownership.
If he really believed this bunch of clods could make a run at a playoff spot, why didn't he add help for a terrible bullpen? Why?
I've been following the Giants since 1957, and this is just about THE WORST collection of bullpen personnel I've ever seen on the Giants.
THAT is on Farhan.
3a-He lied about the reasons for not moving Rodon. Again, I'll repeat myself; it makes MORE sense to get multiple players back, EVEN IF THEY AREN'T TOP NOTCH prospects, rather than 1...ONE crappy compensatory pick!
I'd rather take my chances on 3 to 5 nobodies, than one nobody.
The idea HAS been floated that 'once a Dodger always a Dodger,' and right now, as much as I hate to admit it... that position has some credibility. Not much, but some.
3b- He lied or simply deceived himself about this team and their ability to make a play off run. With all of the injuries to Wade, DesClafani, Belt, Cobb, Longo (multiple times), Alvarez, even a dead Cheshire cat could see this team wasn't going anywhere. But not him. Why is that?
And I am TIRED of him saying he wanted to show 'support' for the players. Blow it out your pie hole, Farhan! You had other reasons; an agenda your not talking about.
3c-He has done NOTHING, and I mean NOTHING to show anyone that this team has a shot at ANY PLACE OTHER THAN 3RD PLACE for the next 3 years.
LA and SD made HUGE improvements.
We added JD Davis. A nice player, but a role player.
HE claims he's made legit runs for Stanton, Harper and Soto, but the reality is, hitters DON'T want to come here!
How come WE can see that, but he can't?
So why in the world would this pin head believe even for a moment that he'll be able to lure ANY big time hitter here in the off season?
Again, another deceitful action.
To ME, what he has done is a fire-able offense; offenses.
Not that I'd fire him, but it would sure be on my mind.
When we hired this guy, I was unhappy, but I said I'd give him 5 years.
Well, Okeechobee-Bob, next year is year 5... and we aren't any closer to the play offs, we're further away than ever!
And all of THAT is on Farhan.
Period.
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Post by surflust on Aug 11, 2022 13:46:56 GMT -5
I watched all 3 games against padres. It is hard to understand how this team, basically same team as last year, without posey can have so many hitters with Averages 30-60 points below last season. I understand/expect dropoff for one, two players on any team but to have the whole team dive bomb is hard to fathom. All last season we heard, "its the system, not the players".. well WTF aren't they still using the system.
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Post by reedonly on Aug 12, 2022 8:58:32 GMT -5
Farhan always has had a blind spot towards bullpens even at LA. Notice how this aspect of the Dodgers got better after he left. They used to always wear down the middle guys and closer Kenley lost effectiveness for a couple of seasons. After Farhan left the Dodgers, they felt relief needed more attention so they got Trienen and Graeterol but Farhan seems to not prioritize the bullpen and just stock it with whomever is available.
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Post by reedonly on Aug 12, 2022 10:37:52 GMT -5
and inexplicably have career years; they DON'T follow them up with even decent ones.
Solano after his 2020 season, this past year, Crawford and Belt, and Webb.
By ignoring history, he repeated it.
2-He ignored the track records of players who have not had decent careers; Leone, Little, and Alvarez just to name a few.
3-I stand by what I have said from day one; Farhan was, is and continues to be deceitful to the fans and ownership.
If he really believed this bunch of clods could make a run at a playoff spot, why didn't he add help for a terrible bullpen? Why?
I've been following the Giants since 1957, and this is just about THE WORST collection of bullpen personnel I've ever seen on the Giants.
THAT is on Farhan.
3a-He lied about the reasons for not moving Rodon. Again, I'll repeat myself; it makes MORE sense to get multiple players back, EVEN IF THEY AREN'T TOP NOTCH prospects, rather than 1...ONE crappy compensatory pick!
I'd rather take my chances on 3 to 5 nobodies, than one nobody.
The idea HAS been floated that 'once a Dodger always a Dodger,' and right now, as much as I hate to admit it... that position has some credibility. Not much, but some.
3b- He lied or simply deceived himself about this team and their ability to make a play off run. With all of the injuries to Wade, DesClafani, Belt, Cobb, Longo (multiple times), Alvarez, even a dead Cheshire cat could see this team wasn't going anywhere. But not him. Why is that?
And I am TIRED of him saying he wanted to show 'support' for the players. Blow it out your pie hole, Farhan! You had other reasons; an agenda your not talking about.
3c-He has done NOTHING, and I mean NOTHING to show anyone that this team has a shot at ANY PLACE OTHER THAN 3RD PLACE for the next 3 years.
LA and SD made HUGE improvements.
We added JD Davis. A nice player, but a role player.
HE claims he's made legit runs for Stanton, Harper and Soto, but the reality is, hitters DON'T want to come here!
How come WE can see that, but he can't?
So why in the world would this pin head believe even for a moment that he'll be able to lure ANY big time hitter here in the off season?
Again, another deceitful action.
To ME, what he has done is a fire-able offense; offenses.
Not that I'd fire him, but it would sure be on my mind.
When we hired this guy, I was unhappy, but I said I'd give him 5 years.
Well, Okeechobee-Bob, next year is year 5... and we aren't any closer to the play offs, we're further away than ever!
And all of THAT is on Farhan.
Period. I'm not sure about Soto not wanting to come. The Nationals just dealt Soto to the team which had the best trade package. However, before the trade, we were hoping a Soto trade would not happen because it would have gutted the farm system. The best thing for Farhan to do is to keep building the organization, make the minors sustainable, and quit fishing out of the dumpsters. The dumpster diving was supposed to raise the floor of the team but this year's version of the churn seemed to go backwards and its clear some of the players they went after were unacceptable. As to Harper, if I remember correctly, the Phillies added a thirteenth year or something like that. I'm not sure if paying Harper through the next decade is wise. Its not always his fault, but Harper gets injured a lot and it must be taking a wear and tear.
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Post by klaiggeb on Aug 12, 2022 10:43:49 GMT -5
Trading away the farm for a superstar, to ME, is almost always foolish.
Now Free Agents... that's difference.
MY perspective is that you DON'T gut the farm system for one guy.
When you do that, you have to put "fillers" in the field, guys that really are below average, and wouldn't necessarily be someone you'd want playing full time.
That's what happened a lot when we had Bonds.
Don't want to see it again.
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Post by reedonly on Aug 12, 2022 15:19:05 GMT -5
Trading away the farm for a superstar, to ME, is almost always foolish. Now Free Agents... that's difference. MY perspective is that you DON'T gut the farm system for one guy. When you do that, you have to put "fillers" in the field, guys that really are below average, and wouldn't necessarily be someone you'd want playing full time. That's what happened a lot when we had Bonds. Don't want to see it again. when the Giants lost Burks and Kent, they were intentionally walking Bonds until doomsday. When Soto was on the Nationals, he was frequently walked. It would have been the same if he were traded to the Giants which is why they should not have been in on him in the first place. The only reason for the Giants to have been in on Soto would be to drive up the Nationals' asking price for Soto but the way Zaidi was talking, they were serious.
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Post by klaiggeb on Aug 12, 2022 16:35:31 GMT -5
The more I observe BFF, Reed, the more convinced I become that he's in it to put fannies in seats.
He wants to be competitive, but IMHO, that's it.
If we win, he's okay with that. But if we don't, and we have a super star who brings out the fans, that's fine too.
Bottom line: I question if he's a winner or just a front office stooge.
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Post by reedonly on Aug 14, 2022 19:58:32 GMT -5
The more I observe BFF, Reed, the more convinced I become that he's in it to put fannies in seats.
He wants to be competitive, but IMHO, that's it.
If we win, he's okay with that. But if we don't, and we have a super star who brings out the fans, that's fine too.
Bottom line: I question if he's a winner or just a front office stooge. I think they are realizing that the pandemic has depressed attendance across the board in the majors and the attendance in 2022 is even worse than in the years they were losing. There are a lot of reasons for the decline, some of it is in their control, some of it is not. The stuff in their control is crappy team, lack of stars, expense of going to games, Mission Bay construction. Even when they were having the 107 win season in 2021, they still were in the middle of the pack. There is a lot of stuff that is affecting the team that is not in their control. Pandemic has moved workers to WFH and Oracle is no longer a destination after work. Transit to the park is now inadequate. San Francisco is getting really seedy downtown and around the park. Also, the corporate group sales (roughly 300000 tickets/year) is pretty much gone. Furthermore, up to earlier this year, San Francisco had the strictest COVID restrictions. The Giants can do what they can but it's going to take more than one single superstar to fix things. They might have to have more corporate incentives, discounts for non-premium games (there are some $9 value games for Tuesdays, Wednesdays, and Thursdays but there should be more), or maybe even lean on the city to provide more transit or police presence in the area. Even though they have all these built in excuses, other teams have these problems also.
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Blame Game
Aug 14, 2022 21:11:13 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by klaiggeb on Aug 14, 2022 21:11:13 GMT -5
I don't doubt that everything you said is true, but you simply cannot have a team of underperformers, a general manager/ Management Group not bringing in quality players, and then lie to your fans about how you want to be competitive.
As I continue to contend, this is on BFF.
He didn't even try to improve the team, he just took what he had and went with him.
It's that lack of effort on management's part that upsets me more than anything
I'm going to be gone for a week and will not have access to watch the games, which for me, is just as well, because this is hard to take.
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Post by reedonly on Aug 15, 2022 8:14:38 GMT -5
Well, if you are on a cruise, don't waste money on data to read this board or the scores. Its not worth it.
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Blame Game
Aug 15, 2022 10:38:45 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by klaiggeb on Aug 15, 2022 10:38:45 GMT -5
I wish!!!!
We are off to see family
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Post by reedonly on Aug 18, 2022 10:35:37 GMT -5
What bothers me is that the giants have a lot of information at their disposal but the behavior is strange on the way they use the data.
On the field and in games, they are very rigid about the way they position and flip the lineups but in the front office, they tend to be more improvisational and go against a lot of conventional sabermetric thinking. For example, last year, data showed high BABIP from offense and low BABIP from pitchers implying the way they got 107 wins was somewhat lucky. Also, at the trade deadline, he can see the fangraphs projection of playoff odds at ~10% and the whole fanbase was screaming to trade Rodon, even if it were for an underwhelming return. Basic math states that a 10% shot at making the playoffs also means that chances of making the playoffs is 9 to 1 (which means 9 failures for each possible success, which is not good betting odds). Even with the five game win streak the chances to make the playoffs rose to 7% so I'm not sure what they were thinking. Its weird that at the trade deadline, they threw all the stats geek information out the window when they should have been paying attention to it. The BABIP data means that guys are in a slump this season might not break out of it, its more that they were lucky last season and playing this season the way that old slow, bad defense guys are expected to play.
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Post by reedonly on Sept 6, 2022 15:30:50 GMT -5
Boly: He lied about the reasons for not moving Rodon. Again, I'll repeat myself; it makes MORE sense to get multiple players back, EVEN IF THEY AREN'T TOP NOTCH prospects, rather than 1...ONE crappy compensatory pick!
We're now a month past the trade deadline and from what I've heard, it looks like they are going to make Rodon an offer and try to extend Pederson. One guy who might have been a Farhan candidate to replace Rodon had a bad day on Saturday and that is Noah Syndergaard. Kruk and Kuip said that the fastball was nowhere to be seen and he did worse than Junis.
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Post by klaiggeb on Sept 6, 2022 20:36:20 GMT -5
Boly: He lied about the reasons for not moving Rodon. Again, I'll repeat myself; it makes MORE sense to get multiple players back, EVEN IF THEY AREN'T TOP NOTCH prospects, rather than 1...ONE crappy compensatory pick! We're now a month past the trade deadline and from what I've heard, it looks like they are going to make Rodon an offer and try to extend Pederson. One guy who might have been a Farhan candidate to replace Rodon had a bad day on Saturday and that is Noah Syndergaard. Kruk and Kuip said that the fastball was nowhere to be seen and he did worse than Junis. Very true. Then again, he's just recently back from TJ surgery.
I'd take Thor in a heartbeat!
Even w/o that high octane gas, he's better than Junis or DesClafani.
Next year will tell, that's for sure!
I just can't see a Boras client NOT playing one team against another and pricing himself out of the Giant's range.
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Post by reedonly on Sept 12, 2022 15:38:33 GMT -5
Boly: Bottom line: I question if he's a winner or just a front office stooge.
Soitinly
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