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New Giant
Mar 11, 2022 19:44:42 GMT -5
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Post by Islandboagie on Mar 11, 2022 19:44:42 GMT -5
Carlos Rodon, 2 years $44 million.
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Post by reedonly on Mar 11, 2022 21:39:17 GMT -5
Wow. From Rodon's comments, he was impressed by the Giants' record last season {"hard to say no") and if the Giants can figure out load management, this could be a good fit. The injury history is risky, though.
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Post by reedonly on Mar 11, 2022 23:32:49 GMT -5
Also, Heyman reported that Giants are one of the top five in on Suzuki.
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Post by reedonly on Mar 11, 2022 23:49:52 GMT -5
Carlos Rodon, 2 years $44 million. There's an opt out after the first year.
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Post by reedonly on Mar 16, 2022 10:21:42 GMT -5
Suzuki is off the table having signed a five year deal with the Cubs. Schwarber also signed elsewhere. I'm hearing they're going after Conforto but there is a QO attached to him.
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Post by reedonly on Mar 16, 2022 19:10:05 GMT -5
Reports say the new new Giant is Joc Pederson. No terms yet.
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Post by klaiggeb on Mar 16, 2022 20:20:43 GMT -5
Reports say the new new Giant is Joc Pederson. No terms yet. If this is true, Reed, I have to say, I do not understand the move.
I really don't.
I've looked up Pederson defensive numbers, and at best, he's average with a better than average arm.
LA rarely played him vs LHP, and when they did, it wasn't very good.
Last year he had 112 PA vs LH, hit .265, with .345 OBP.
In addition, though he's not a base clogger, like Ruff, is, again, he's average at best.
For his career?
Again, not particularly good.
He's hit .232 with an OBP of .332, with an average of 17.4 HRs/year.
Could someone please explain why they think this is a smart move for us?
If it takes ab's away from Duggar, I'm going to be ticked!
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Post by reedonly on Mar 16, 2022 22:23:22 GMT -5
Similar to Conforto but cheaper and no QO. Platoon with Slater.
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New Giant
Mar 16, 2022 23:21:13 GMT -5
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Post by Islandboagie on Mar 16, 2022 23:21:13 GMT -5
With the DH in the NL now I think landing someone like Pederson is a good move.
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New Giant
Mar 17, 2022 8:41:22 GMT -5
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Post by klaiggeb on Mar 17, 2022 8:41:22 GMT -5
I guess I will have to take a wait and see attitude, I just don't see how attic another left-handed bat helps us.
Consider the Yaz, duggar, belt, crawford, all hit from the left side
That is one half of the offensive slots.
I would have preferred a right-handed bat, because I do not want to see Darren ruff in the outfield.
I have been wrong many times before, and I hope I am wrong here. But I do not like the move
Then again, it's hard to Farhan because he has been pretty right on in almost every move he's made.
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Post by reedonly on Mar 17, 2022 9:21:16 GMT -5
To be honest, all of the outfield candidates are flawed and carry a lot of risk. The Giants were out of the running on Bryant from the get-go, Castellanos, cost too much, Suzuki at 5y/$85mm + $15mm posting fee to Hiroshima might have been the most compelling but who knows how well his production in Japan translates to MLB. When I saw that they were looking at Conforto, I was getting worried. Conforto already turned down the QO from the Mets so if the Giants signed Conforto, they would have to give up a draft pick, international pool money, and Conforto would have cost at least $17mm per year. Conforto's slash line in 2021 was .232/14/55 similar to Pederson's .238/18/61. I am not excited that they signed Pederson but much relieved that they did not sign Conforto.
With all of the FA buzz going on right now, no one is talking about the farm. Signing someone like Conforto to a long term deal might have blocked a farmhand later on. Baggerly was saying this morning that it would have been a risk to sign one of these FA outfielders but with age and mileage on the Giants, Baggerly felt it might be a bigger risk not to sign one. I prefer to think that Zaidi and Harris are taking a view of an even bigger picture and maybe its time that the Giants finally again become the team that utilizes their own homegrown talent.
I know that LA signed Freeman yesterday. Sucks, but they still have to play the games so let's see how that plays out. Even though I would have liked Freddie on the Giants, something in the back of my mind says he might not be all that, especially if the Braves did not re-sign him. The 2022 version of Freddie Freeman is not the same as the 2016 version and their pitching might have taken a hit, especially if they do not re-sign Jansen.
Even though I grew not to like Bryant in SF, I think Colorado is a good fit for him, especially with the insane amount of money they gave him. He's going to be the centerpiece of a young team and his power numbers should go back up in Colorado.
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Post by reedonly on Mar 17, 2022 10:21:54 GMT -5
Krukow was comparing Pederson to Dickerson on his show this morning. I think one of us (Rxmeister or Boagie?) said he was the same guy. Its true the two have similar batting averages, not good fielders, similar power. Krukow said that the difference between the two is that Pederson has a better history in pressure situations. Also, Pederson being friends with Crawford is going to bring a good clubhouse presence. Furthermore, Pederson is a Zaidi guy. He's close to Farhan and in the 80th percentile in terms of exit velocity and likes to work his at bats. I don't think that .260/20HR is out of the question. Krukow also said that since he is coming home, he could be focusing on doing better. $6mm for one year of Pederson is far better than doling out $17Xmultiple years for the same production in Conforto or some other guy. Let whomever signs Castellanos or Conforto have buyer's remorse.
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Post by reedonly on Mar 17, 2022 10:25:10 GMT -5
And new new new Giants keep coming. At midnight, they announced the signing of Boyd from Detroit. He is not expected to be ready until summer but that's when they expect one of the others to go down. Also, Junis is expected to be one of those swingman pieces so there's our 2021 Guillermo Mota.
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Post by reedonly on Mar 17, 2022 10:37:15 GMT -5
I'm hearing the next thing on the agenda is finding the second base-outfield-infield piece (a la Max Muncy and Chris Taylor) to use as a rover. Brock Holt is a FA and made near the major league minimum last season so it might be someone like that according to Farhan
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New Giant
Mar 17, 2022 15:53:35 GMT -5
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Post by reedonly on Mar 17, 2022 15:53:35 GMT -5
Joc may or may not take away ABs from Duggar but if he takes them away from Conforto, that’s good. Just to illustrate the point: Baseball reference's closest comps for Pederson are Adam Duvall and Michael Conforto. So, Giants probably get a little less production for a lot less money (tens of millions, a draft pick, and international pool money).
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New Giant
Mar 17, 2022 16:08:39 GMT -5
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Post by Islandboagie on Mar 17, 2022 16:08:39 GMT -5
Although I like the low risk moves thus far, we haven't come close to replacing Posey's production in the lineup.
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Post by reedonly on Mar 17, 2022 18:42:04 GMT -5
Seems like the Brandons will try to fill the leadership void now there because of Posey's retirement but that is a big void to fill.
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Post by reedonly on Mar 18, 2022 10:34:44 GMT -5
I know that LA signed Freeman yesterday. Sucks, but they still have to play the games so let's see how that plays out. Even though I would have liked Freddie on the Giants, something in the back of my mind says he might not be all that, especially if the Braves did not re-sign him. The 2022 version of Freddie Freeman is not the same as the 2016 version and their pitching might have taken a hit, especially if they do not re-sign Jansen.
To clarify my comment on Freeman. Last year, one poster seemed to like Freeman so much he felt Freeman was a generational talent and would go after at all costs. I feel he's not quite up to that level but I do think he's on a younger Paul Goldschmidt level which is more than decent. When I think of "generational talent", I'm thinking of a Mike Trout or Willie Mays (not Bryce Harper as Farhan thinks). We should probably think of the Freeman acquisition as replacing Seager's productivity, not adding to the 2021 team. As it is, fangraphs increased the Dodgers' expected number of wins by 4. I think the Dodgers are not done yet and I can see them acquiring players from the fire sale teams (A's and Reds).
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Post by klaiggeb on Mar 18, 2022 10:55:16 GMT -5
To be honest, all of the outfield candidates are flawed and carry a lot of risk. The Giants were out of the running on Bryant from the get-go, Castellanos, cost too much, Suzuki at 5y/$85mm + $15mm posting fee to Hiroshima might have been the most compelling but who knows how well his production in Japan translates to MLB. When I saw that they were looking at Conforto, I was getting worried. Conforto already turned down the QO from the Mets so if the Giants signed Conforto, they would have to give up a draft pick, international pool money, and Conforto would have cost at least $17mm per year. Conforto's slash line in 2021 was .232/14/55 similar to Pederson's .238/18/61. I am not excited that they signed Pederson but much relieved that they did not sign Conforto.
With all of the FA buzz going on right now, no one is talking about the farm. Signing someone like Conforto to a long term deal might have blocked a farmhand later on. Baggerly was saying this morning that it would have been a risk to sign one of these FA outfielders but with age and mileage on the Giants, Baggerly felt it might be a bigger risk not to sign one. I prefer to think that Zaidi and Harris are taking a view of an even bigger picture and maybe its time that the Giants finally again become the team that utilizes their own homegrown talent.
I know that LA signed Freeman yesterday. Sucks, but they still have to play the games so let's see how that plays out. Even though I would have liked Freddie on the Giants, something in the back of my mind says he might not be all that, especially if the Braves did not re-sign him. The 2022 version of Freddie Freeman is not the same as the 2016 version and their pitching might have taken a hit, especially if they do not re-sign Jansen.
Even though I grew not to like Bryant in SF, I think Colorado is a good fit for him, especially with the insane amount of money they gave him. He's going to be the centerpiece of a young team and his power numbers should go back up in Colorado. Reed, that was an outstanding post! And you answered an awful lot of questions for me!
I knew I did NOT want Castellanos in any shape or form. Terrible on defense, DH or no DH. We have Ruff for that.
Again, thanks for being so inciteful!!!
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New Giant
Mar 18, 2022 13:29:57 GMT -5
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Post by Islandboagie on Mar 18, 2022 13:29:57 GMT -5
That was a very good post, Reed. Conforto wasn't even on my radar, I just figured the inability to land Suzuki forced them to grab Pederson. It's hard to decipher a lot of the articles have a number of varying assessments on any movement. For instance I've read a number or articles portraying Bryant as the one that got away, whereas I believe him to be the one that was thrown back.
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Post by reedonly on Mar 18, 2022 15:52:54 GMT -5
That was a very good post, Reed. Conforto wasn't even on my radar, I just figured the inability to land Suzuki forced them to grab Pederson. It's hard to decipher a lot of the articles have a number of varying assessments on any movement. For instance I've read a number or articles portraying Bryant as the one that got away, whereas I believe him to be the one that was thrown back. I think they did not realize that the price for Suzuki would have gone as high as it did. Remember, the Hiroshima Carp receive a posting fee in addition to whatever Suzuki makes so the true out of pocket is now at $100 million.. I have a feeling that the news that we receive locally is different than the national feed. From what I've heard, they were high on Suzuki but ducked out when the out of pocket went past $85 million, then pivoted to Conforto, then signed Pederson. I was surprised that Suzuki went to Chicago but upon further research, there is a sizable Japanese community near Chicago west of O'Hare in Elk Grove and huge Korean markets downtown. Korean food is a bit heavier than Japanese but share a lot of similar foods. they had to get Pederson because after Pederson, its a big drop off to guys like Dexter Fowler, Kevin Pillar, Jarrod Dyson, Almora, and Tauchman and Castellanos and Conforto would have blocked our farmhands. Next year, the farm has to really start producing because the 2023 FA class of outfielders is going to be weak. We're talking Aaron Judge, Pederson, Duvall, and Kiki. Bryant was never in the picture so he was never the one that got away. Not once did Zaidi show any interest other than the obligatory "lets see where the market takes us". Nationally, the sportswriters like Bisbee are having a cow about the Giants not keeping up with the Dodgers. They are right if you only consider 2022 but the objective is to grow the organization and be a more self-sustaining organization. A lot of key Dodgers are becoming more injury prone (Betts, J Turner, Kershw, Muncy). they may have a high priced all-star team now but it wouldn't take much for them to become an overpriced, injury prone team. As I mentioned before, there will come a time when they have to stop using these free agents and start using guys like Matos, Luciano, and so forth.
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Post by klaiggeb on Mar 18, 2022 20:25:31 GMT -5
Just as an FYI, since I have a fair amount of experience here; The Koreans, Chinese and Japanese do not get along at all.
That Suzuki would go there because Chicago has a large Japanese population, however, is very understandable.
Heck, it was ME signing with a Japanese team... I'd want to go where the most Americans were.
As to Bryant... I never wanted him back. I seem to recall most on this board having the same sentiments.
Looked GREAT when we got him... but he was NOT as advertised, or at least, what I thought he was.
Not a clutch hitter, poor defensively, and just not worth the money, IMHO.
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Post by reedonly on Mar 18, 2022 21:11:45 GMT -5
Just as an FYI, since I have a fair amount of experience here; The Koreans, Chinese and Japanese do not get along at all.
That Suzuki would go there because Chicago has a large Japanese population, however, is very understandable.
Heck, it was ME signing with a Japanese team... I'd want to go where the most Americans were.
As to Bryant... I never wanted him back. I seem to recall most on this board having the same sentiments.
Looked GREAT when we got him... but he was NOT as advertised, or at least, what I thought he was.
Not a clutch hitter, poor defensively, and just not worth the money, IMHO. In Japan, before the pandemic, there were a lot of tourists coming from China and Korea to the point where the trains had translation in Japanese, English, Korean, and Chinese. The young people like their k pop and there is a lot more mixing of their foods. As to Bryant, his closest comp is Richard Hidalgo. Hidalgo was out of baseball by age 30.
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Post by reedonly on Mar 18, 2022 21:28:08 GMT -5
I'm hearing the next thing on the agenda is finding the second base-outfield-infield piece (a la Max Muncy and Chris Taylor) to use as a rover. Brock Holt is a FA and made near the major league minimum last season so it might be someone like that according to Farhan Giants are one of four teams in on Trevor Story according the Heymann. One other team is Boston and two other mystery teams.
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Post by klaiggeb on Mar 19, 2022 10:13:40 GMT -5
I'm hearing the next thing on the agenda is finding the second base-outfield-infield piece (a la Max Muncy and Chris Taylor) to use as a rover. Brock Holt is a FA and made near the major league minimum last season so it might be someone like that according to Farhan Giants are one of four teams in on Trevor Story according the Heymann. One other team is Boston and two other mystery teams. Yeah... I saw that this morning.
I don't know if I want us to get him or not.
Does he possess the footwork to play 2B?
Trea Turner made the switch, and it sure would be nice to have an arm like Trevor's at 2B.
Obviously I like his power numbers, and I like the fact that Story can run...but at the same time, I was hoping Estrada would get a legit shot.
Then again, Reed, as you posted, the Giants are/were in the market for a guy that could play 2B/ OF and other places, and Estrada sure fits that bill!
But what about La Stella? I know he's played some 3B... making 89 of his346 MLB there... but he has one of the poorest infield arms I've ever seen.
Accurate, yes, but very little velocity on his throws.
I guess the bottom line for me is, I'd like Thairo to play a lot, but if Story puts us in a spot to actually contend again, I'm all for it.
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Post by klaiggeb on Mar 19, 2022 10:16:10 GMT -5
Just as an FYI, since I have a fair amount of experience here; The Koreans, Chinese and Japanese do not get along at all.
That Suzuki would go there because Chicago has a large Japanese population, however, is very understandable.
Heck, it was ME signing with a Japanese team... I'd want to go where the most Americans were.
As to Bryant... I never wanted him back. I seem to recall most on this board having the same sentiments.
Looked GREAT when we got him... but he was NOT as advertised, or at least, what I thought he was.
Not a clutch hitter, poor defensively, and just not worth the money, IMHO. In Japan, before the pandemic, there were a lot of tourists coming from China and Korea to the point where the trains had translation in Japanese, English, Korean, and Chinese. The young people like their k pop and there is a lot more mixing of their foods. As to Bryant, his closest comp is Richard Hidalgo. Hidalgo was out of baseball by age 30. lI don't doubt your facts here at all, Reed...I'm just saying that when I was teaching at Villanova,(which boarded a large number of foreign students) we had a LOT of Japanese and Korean, and a smattering of Chinese students, and they could NOT be roomed together.
Hopefully times have changed and that's no longer the issue it once was. And by your post it appears it has, and that's a good thing!
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New Giant
Mar 19, 2022 12:42:42 GMT -5
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Post by Islandboagie on Mar 19, 2022 12:42:42 GMT -5
Asians like other Asian food because they tend to use a lot of the same ingredients and spices. Lots of seafood, pork, chicken rice, garlic and ginger. They also like a lot of their dishes to be either sweet and/or spicy. But that doesn't mean they like each other. I won't say they're racist, but they're very prejudice and fixate on stereotypes even outside of other Asian countries. I dated a Vietnamese chick for 3 years just recently. She enjoyed certain food and entertainment from other countries but was prejudice towards every one of them.
I realize me saying that makes me seem prejudice too, because I'm basing my opinion on a rather small sample, but her entire family expressed the same views. Her mother infact told me that she was only okay with her daughter dating another vietnamese or a white guy. She claimed her daughter would be disowned if she dated a Chinese, Mexican or African.
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Post by reedonly on Mar 20, 2022 10:38:40 GMT -5
Just as an FYI, since I have a fair amount of experience here; The Koreans, Chinese and Japanese do not get along at all.
That Suzuki would go there because Chicago has a large Japanese population, however, is very understandable.
Heck, it was ME signing with a Japanese team... I'd want to go where the most Americans were.
As to Bryant... I never wanted him back. I seem to recall most on this board having the same sentiments.
Looked GREAT when we got him... but he was NOT as advertised, or at least, what I thought he was.
Not a clutch hitter, poor defensively, and just not worth the money, IMHO. Prior to pandemic, we visited the Bamboo Forest in Kyoto. It was definitely not the peaceful scene decribed in the media. It was overrun with hundreds of Mainland Chinese tourists and even a dozen rickshaws. It was noisy and chaotic.
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Post by reedonly on Mar 20, 2022 10:47:25 GMT -5
I'm hearing the next thing on the agenda is finding the second base-outfield-infield piece (a la Max Muncy and Chris Taylor) to use as a rover. Brock Holt is a FA and made near the major league minimum last season so it might be someone like that according to Farhan Giants are one of four teams in on Trevor Story according the Heymann. One other team is Boston and two other mystery teams. Story to Boston at 7yrs/$140mm. That's surprising because Chaim Bloom has the same economic mindset as Zaidi. After the Giants signed Pedersen, I was surprised they were in on Story at all. However, giving $140mm to a guy who hit .203 outside of Coors last year is not a good idea. The price was expected to go up when news broke yesterday that the Yankees were in on Story, also. Zaidi has mentioned Brock Holt as the rover so I'm expecting Holt. Also, La Stella has been reported to be recovering faster than anticipated, which likely means he will be re-injured faster than anticipated.
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Post by reedonly on Mar 20, 2022 10:55:22 GMT -5
Just as an FYI, since I have a fair amount of experience here; The Koreans, Chinese and Japanese do not get along at all.
That Suzuki would go there because Chicago has a large Japanese population, however, is very understandable.
Heck, it was ME signing with a Japanese team... I'd want to go where the most Americans were.
As to Bryant... I never wanted him back. I seem to recall most on this board having the same sentiments.
Looked GREAT when we got him... but he was NOT as advertised, or at least, what I thought he was.
Not a clutch hitter, poor defensively, and just not worth the money, IMHO. Apparently, Yu Darvish and his wife talked the Suzukis into it (you're going to love it). Once they sold Suzuki's wife on Chicago, that was a done deal.
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