OK I have to say it....

[garyd4sf]

I haven't read all the threads here but one subject I can't let pass is the continual snubbing of Barry Bonds. I have been to the Cooperstown hall of fame and there is no way that Barry doesn't qualify.

He was among the best of his generation for several decades. He had HOF credentials before he was a Giant and added to that lore in a less than hitters park. One can only compare the ball players to the era that they are in.

The spitball era didn't have many HRs hit. But pitchers ERAs was lower as well.  

The loaded bat era had too many hits and expanded Bat averages including singles hitters.

 The low mound era favored the hitters And not the pitchers. and on and on.

To exclude Barry out of the Hall negates that stuffy archive by leaving the voting not by the fans but an August (read old fogies here!) group who hold themselves as voter, judge and executioner for those they want to keep out. Barry likely used peds and was said to do so in seeing the dual HR race of 2 guys (Sosa, McGwire) that also used peds and nothing said, pitchers used peds and added to their speed (Dodger closer, Gagne).

I've been to the Basketball, and NFL HOF and the voting there has more to do with actual participants, than some self inflated writers. Its time to make the hall truly for the best, not the best loved. If the latter, Ty  Cobb would have been left out.

And I'd vote for Pete Rose as well.

[Islandboagie]

I agree. One big argument behind NOT allowing players who somehow cheated the game in the HoF is to not allow them to become an example for kids growing up. Fathers don't want to take their kids to the HoF and explain why a cheater got recognized in the HoF. It's a bad example to follow. I think we all understand that.

The only problem is, cheaters have been kept out, kids have gone there, and there's probably more cheating going on now than ever before. The plan has failed.

If you want to punish the players punish them monetarily and severely. Don't punish the learning process. Put those players in the hall, but tell their entire story.

Roger Clemens and Barry Bonds belong there. You could make an argument for Palmeiro and McGwire. Pete Rose should be there as should Shoeless Joe. Let them in, but tell the story.

[garyd4sf]

Jan 20, 2020 19:43:43 GMT -5 Islandboagie said:

I agree. One big argument behind NOT allowing players who somehow cheated the game in the HoF is to not allow them to become an example for kids growing up. Fathers don't want to take their kids to the HoF and explain why a cheater got recognized in the HoF. It's a bad example to follow. I think we all understand that.

The only problem is, cheaters have been kept out, kids have gone there, and there's probably more cheating going on now than ever before. The plan has failed.

If you want to punish the players punish them monetarily and severely. Don't punish the learning process. Put those players in the hall, but tell their entire story.

Roger Clemens and Barry Bonds belong there. You could make an argument for Palmeiro and McGwire. Pete Rose should be there as should Shoeless Joe. Let them in, but tell the story.

Good point. To err is human.

But players who obviously are the best cant be denied because they got caught or even suspected of wrongdoing. Laud their accomplishments. That's the intent of any athletic Hall of Fame.

But as you said let the information regarding their possible wrongdoings also be told. Shoeless Joe is a forgotten memory due to the righteousness of some determined to play judge.

On this Martin Luther day we celebrate a man for the content of his character, and not his flawlessness.

[klaiggeb]

Agree with both of you.

Was Barry ever convicted of cheating? or is it all speculation?

[klaiggeb]

Agree with both of you.

Was Barry ever convicted of cheating? or is it all speculation?