Swell. OF that can't hit

[klaiggeb]

Well hold me down and get the defibrillator ready; we're signing Cameron Maybin.

Don't know if I can contain my excitement.

That Zaidi. He sure can find those hidden gems...

Like the title of the thread says: Swell; another outfielder that can't hit.

Perfect.

[Islandboagie]

I wouldn't mind so much that he cant hit all that well if he was still in his prime. He could go get it in his prime, now? Not so much.

[rog]

So what move do you guys want the Giants to make?

[Islandboagie]

I want them to pony up the money for Harper. I want them to stop accumulating over 30 y/o scrap heapers and focus on putting together a younger more athletic outfield. Even if that means trading Belt and or Panik.

[rog]

The Giants have focused on adding younger, more athletic outfielders via the Rule 5 Draft and the waiver wire. Obviously except in unusual situations such as Bryce Harper, those guys aren't available in free agency, which is almost always the area of players around or beyond 30.

If the Giants are able to sign Bryce, they've got enough potential pieces for the outfield now that they should be able to cobble together a platoon package to fit with Harper. They entered the winter with a player in Shaw who didn't appear to be close to being ready; a center fielder in Duggar who looks like a plus fielder but has to be able to get on base to become a first-division center fielder; a right or left fielder in Williamson who certainly tantalized last season before being beaned; and a corner outfielder in Slater who could be useful if he can become aggressive and as he's trying to do this winter, significantly increase his launch angle. Slater can hit the ball hard, but when he does so, it is usually on the ground.

In other words, while they're almost lost in question marks, the Giants entered the winter with two outfield pieces (Duggar and Williamson) who could matter, and one in Slater who could become a valuable fourth or fifth outfielder. I think Parra, Maybin and Dickerson add to the mix, so at least there's some potential depth.

As you know, I'm leery of trading Belt and/or Panik before they can rebuild their trade value and the Giants can acquire or identify replacements for them, but it will likely benefit the Giants to trade Belt within the next year, opening up room for Joey Bart.

I think Tony Watson would be a good guy to trade. I see his value more likely to go down than up from here, and the Rule 5 addition of Travis Bergen plus the strong late-season appearance from Steve Okert last season could allow to avoid missing Tony too much.

Okert struck out 51 batters in 39 innings between Sacramento and SF last season, walking only eight. I believe he is out of options. Bergen had a similar K/BB ratio while putting up a 0.50 ERA in his first exposure to AA last season. He must be kept on the roster this season or be offered back to the Blue Jays for $50,000. Pat Venditte throws with either hand, but it appears to me he is best suited to be a LOOGY.

With their closer Will Smith also being a southpaw, the Giants seem well prepared to cover should they trade Watson. Tony has some value, although to get a truly good player in return, he would need to be tag teamed with someone like Madison Bumgarner. As Boly mentioned, the Giants are now southpaw-oriented in the rotation, perhaps making it easier to deal Madison.

The Giants do appear to have enough outfield pieces with experience or potential that they might be able to platoon around Harper and get by.

[rog]

This seemed an informative summary of the Giants' off-season by an LA Times writer of all people, as reported at MLB Trade Rumors:


Their courtship of free agent Bryce Harper aside, the Giants haven’t made a lot of headlines since president of baseball operations Farhan Zaidi took the reins in November. Thus far, Derek Holland and Drew Pomeranz – two relatively modest free-agent signings – are the only players who have received major league contracts on Zaidi’s watch. However, the former Dodgers GM has worked diligently to strengthen the Giants’ depth and improve their culture, Andy McCullough of the Los Angeles Times explains. “Coming in, it was pretty clear that that second level of depth just wasn’t there for the organization,” said Zaidi, who has been plenty active via the minor league, waiver and Rule 5 routes early in his Giants stint. He’s also trying to form relationships with the Giants’ key players, some of whom he met with recently to discuss the team’s pitching plans, McCullough reports. While Giants starters Madison Bumgarner and Jeff Samardzija have made their disdain for the opener known lately, it seems Zaidi assured his pitchers the team won’t use relievers at the beginning of games as often as they may fear. Once the meeting ended, Bumgarner approached Zaidi and told him that the anti-opener comment he made to manager Bruce Bochy was in jest.

[rog]

I'm hoping that Farhan's stated goal of making small improvement throughout the 40-man roster will indeed make at least a small impact this season and beyond. The Giants have been far more active at both the end of the 40-man roster and in placing players there then getting them through waivers for minor league depth.

Obviously the Giants need more than this, but if they are somehow able to sign Bryce Harper, those little moves might provide icing for the cake.

[Islandboagie]

If you could drop your "Zaidi is a superhero" bullshit for a minute, maybe we could then get real.

NONE of the moves thus far excite me in the slightest. The only moves that seem decent to me are getting Drew Pomeranz, Jose Lopez, and Gerardo Parra, and 2 of those 3 are over 30 years old. All the other pickups are unlikely to have a shot at making the 25 man roster. I don't hate any of the moves because there's very little risk involved with picking up everyone's trash, but some of these moves just seem useless to me. I'll admit he's stayed busy, but again, I really don't see us any better than we were last season.

Is Parra, Maybin or any of the other no name outfielders we got an upgrade over Blanco? I don't think so, but maybe slightly. They're certainly not an upgrade over McCutchen or Gorkys. So we've gotten worse in the outfield since this time last year.

Drew Pomeranz and Jose Lopez COULD end up making the team, but neither I would project as being a part of the rotation over the guys we currently have. Yes, there's more depth there, but both could find their way out of baseball after this season if they continue to pitch like they did last season. I would probably put both these guys behind Stratton and Blach unless they have very encouraging Spring Training performances. I like Lopez's age and he has a lively fastball, but he has average at best secondary pitches. I used to like Pomeranz when he was with the Padres, he was very solid, but he's now 31 years old and coming off an injury. Again, not terrible moves acquiring either of these guys, but neither is more exciting than what we have already.

As you know, I was a Tomlinson fan, I dont think Solarte is an upgrade, however, he used to give Giants Fits back when he was all over the infield in a Padres uniform. Not a bad move, but I think I'd rather have Tomlinson back instead. Tomlinson worked hard on his defense and became a decent fielder up the middle. Plus he was great in pinch hitting situations, and being right handed he was a nice match with Hanson coming off the bench.

I like our bullpen, but we lost Strickland and haven't upgraded at all.

Overall, I really dont think we're better or younger than we were last season.

[rog]

If you could drop your "Zaidi is a superhero" bullshit for a minute, maybe we could then get real.


Rog -- I didn't mean to saying that Farhan is a super hero. Hopefully he'll turn out to be pretty good, and I'm confident he will, but he's made only little moves so far this off-season. I think re-signing Derek Holland was a nice move, but every other move he's made has ranged between prudent and mostly hoping.

I think he's been seeking value and has underspent rather than overspending, which given that he has signed some decent players to minor league contracts has probably been a good strategy. Aside from Holland, who got a very moderate contract, he's spent practically nothing, and nothing at all that IIRC beyond 2019.

I'm hoping like heck that he can sign Harper and put some excitement in the mix, but as I have stated, even a player as good as Bryce worries me as a long-term signee -- as you may recall was my concern with Giancarlo Stanton. The Giants could really use a big star to get us excited though.

Especially one who isn't starting just ahead at age 30. Of course neither are most of the Giants' top players. They're having to use the rear view mirror.

But while I was happy to see someone recognize what I felt I might have seen too -- that Farhan has made a lot of little moves that collectively might move the meter a tick -- I haven't seen any super hero moves. It may be ironically that his best moves have been the ones he's avoided making thus far.

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[rog]

NONE of the moves thus far excite me in the slightest.


Rog -- I really like the re-signing of Holland. The Pomeranz signing seems a good low-risk gamble. I liked the Rule 5 pickups, since the two players bring either a strikeout arm or an ability to reach base set in a broad if far from rich tool box.

I like getting guys who may still have a little in the tank like Parra, Solarte and Maybin. I like Venditte. The Giants picked up multiple catchers on the very cheap.

All those moves together probably don't get me as excited as signing Harper would, but I can't say some of the moves don't get me excited in the slightest. Perhaps ONLY slightly, but certainly slightly. And I am a little excited by the "sneakiness" of the approach.

Talk about under the radar! Was the radar even on? I guess I just like a good mystery, and if the moves Farhan has made make any significant difference, it will truly have been a good mystery.

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[rog]

Drew Pomeranz and Jose Lopez COULD end up making the team, but neither I would project as being a part of the rotation over the guys we currently have.


Rog -- Lopez must not be much, since I don't even know who he is. Worse, I'm not even sure who he COULD be, so clearly I'm not very on top of this one.

Pomeranz might make a difference. It's not costing much to find out. Will he be better than the young guys? Hard to say. He's not great; they're not great. At least he's one more guy who MIGHT be good and who will give the rotation some of the depth a major league rotation needs these days due to all the injuries.

I'm really glad they re-signed Holland, and merely hopeful with Drew. Clearly they saw something they liked, and it worked for Farhan with players like Max Muncy and Chris Taylor. If he can stay healthy, J.T. Chargois wasn't a bad pickup either, even if it was by the wrong team.




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[rog]

I hadn't thought of it, but Chargois is symbolic of what I'm hoping Farhan has accomplished with all these little moves. The jury is still out on whether J.T. can stay healthy enough to help a major league bullpen, but even Boly has acknowledged his stuff.

The Twins were pleased that they were able to sneak J.T. past 28 teams -- and a bit chargined (or perhaps Chargois-ed) that he didn't make it past the 29th. Farhan recognized the stuff and liked the low risk that Chargois presented by still having an option left. Chargois did suffer more injury, and the Dodgers did utilize his option and send him back to the minors for a bit. But he helped them some last season, and if he stays healthy, will likely help them even more in 2019 and perhaps beyond.

Farhan saw something no one else did. The closest the Giants seemed to come was some crazy guy on one of their blog boards.

Chargois may not turn out to be much of anything. Same with Bergen and Ferguson, etc, etc. But if just one or two of these guys turns out to be meaningul, the attention to detail will have paid off.

[rog]

As you know, I was a Tomlinson fan, I dont think Solarte is an upgrade, however, he used to give Giants Fits back when he was all over the infield in a Padres uniform. Not a bad move, but I think I'd rather have Tomlinson back instead.


Rog -- Both Tomlinson and Solarte seem to be quality people who are easy to root for. It's a shame Kelby didn't have just a bit more talent. He worked hard and did improve his defense. He had a great knack for getting late-inning hits. He is a very fine base runner.

But let's be honest. He wasn't the hitter most thought when he hit .303 and .292. It's not like we weren't warned, but .303 and .292 are impressive averages (even as we were told they weren't sustainable).

Solarte really fell off last season. His .848 OPS in April was excellent, and his .739 and .719 in May and June were acceptable, but he fell off .411, .593 and .286 the final three months were horrific. Kind of like Pablo and Alen from the right side.

But as you say, Solarte has been a decent player over his career. He's quite versatile, and he seems to be a clubhouse favorite.

Maybe he won't turn out to be anything more than Kelby was other than a different TYPE of player. Maybe he won't even make the team. But I like his chances of contributing more than I liked Kelby's, much as I liked Kelby himself.

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[rog]

I like our bullpen, but we lost Strickland and haven't upgraded at all.


Rog -- Hunter had a nice, if frustrating, Giants career. He really tailed off last season, striking out only 7.3 batters per nine and seeing his hard-hit percentage soar from the mid-20%'s in his first three seasons to 42% last year.

I think Bergen and some of the other ecclectic arms the Giants have picked up will replace him, and he was probably only the sixth man out of the bullpen anyway.




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