Memory Help

[klaiggeb]

For those of you who live up in the Bay area, can you fill me in on a couple of things that happened years ago that those of us down in S. California were not privy.

1-When we traded Gaylord to Cleveland for Sudden Sam... were the Giants aware that he had an alcohol problem?

And if they were, why did they go ahead and make the deal?


2-When we moved George Foster to Cincinnati, was ANYONE up in your area, or rather DID anyone up in your area SEE what he could become?

I remember watching him play as a rookie... and I was NOT impressed.



Thanks in advance for your help.

boly

[rog]

To the best of my knowledge, the Giants were caught unaware by Sudden Sam's drinking. Probably not the greatest job of scouting, although scouting may not have been as sophisticated as it is today.

I don't think anyone thought George would become an excellent hitter. His first two seasons with the Reds he hit .234 for them (after the trade) and then .200 in what I believe was an injury-filled season. He hit pretty well in the minors, but nothing to show what he would do in the majors. Even after his very slow start to his major league career, he wound up hitting better in the majors than he did in the minors.

[klaiggeb]

Thanks, Rog.

An early sterioid user?

Maybe?

I mean, such a turn around so quickly?

boly

[klaiggeb]

I suspect you're more than just a little correct on the bad scouting, Rog.

I mean, even a CURSORY look at the numbers tells me A LOT!

In his last 2 seasons with Cleveland his K's/9 were down, from 9.0 to 8.0 and worse, his BB/9 were WAY up! 3.9 to 6.4!


I also suspect that they wanted to get rid of Gaylord so badly, that they were ready to delude themselves into thinking that Sam would 're bound' without really doing their home work.

And from what I've read about Gaylord, he wore out EVERY welcome he ever had, very quickly.

They say he was a pain in the fanny to play behind, never happy with anything, and if there was a mistake behind him? I read he came unglued at the guy, especially if he was a kid.

I've also read that he was into HIS numbers not the team's numbers.

Don't know if any of that is true, but it's what I've read.

boly

[rog]

I hadn't even looked at Sam's numbers prior to the trade. (Remember, I wasn't particularly into stats back then, as weird as that now sounds.) But the numbers you cited certainly tell us the Giants weren't much into the numbers either.

I mentioned that the Giants' scouting wasn't very complete on Sam. While the Indians were in Tuscon and the Giants in Phoenix, they played each other in spring training, and it wouldn't have taken long to find out Sam was a drinker.

I remember sitting close to Johnny Podres in a restaurant, and it was obvious he was a pretty good drinker. Maybe the Giants viewed Sam as he almost certainly viewed himself -- that he drank a lot, but he wasn't an alcoholic and could handle it.