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Post by klaiggeb on Oct 21, 2017 21:50:53 GMT -5
Evans can sugar coat it anyway he likes, but the fact that, when asked his opinion on his shift off the field...Righetti had "no comment."
To ME, that speaks volumes.
It's a move that, to ME, defies explanation.
And that includes shipping Mark Gardner, too.
I've had issues with some of the pitchers Rags has NOT been able to fix, but the fact is, he's a darned good pitching coach.
The only one I've seen who is better, IMHO, is Darren Balsley down in San Diego.
Year in, year out HE comes up with arms for the bullpen, and perhaps even more importantly for me, is he takes arms that are supposedly used up, or over the hill, and milks good things out of him.
So, with Rags out, my "hope" is that Darren is a good friend of Bochy, and wants to be re united.
We had a bad record because of injuries down years by LOTS of players, not just Moore.
We lose Cueto and Bum and Melancon, and THAT'S the heart of the pitching staff.
Now add to that, that both Cueto and Melancon were hurt or ailing and still pitched.
And Rags is to blame?
Sheesh.
For the moment, I'm really unhappy, and I am NOT liking the moves Evans has made both this season, last season, and now in the off season.
The words "moron," and "idiot," and "clueless" are all on the tip of my tongue.
boly
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Post by Rog on Oct 22, 2017 5:09:25 GMT -5
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Post by klaiggeb on Oct 22, 2017 9:25:09 GMT -5
Right now... that would be hard to do, Rog.
I'm going to hold on to them for a while... but all of us need to see much better decision making by Evans than what we've seen.
boly
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Post by Rog on Oct 22, 2017 12:26:02 GMT -5
I like Righetti a lot. Perhaps he will fill the role of Dick Tidrow, who has sheperded the drafting and development of the Giants pitchers. I don't know if Dick is ready to retire or take on a lesser role. Maybe Gardner will taker over the role, although to me that seems less likely. Probably the most likely of all is that Tidrow will remain in his role, or perhaps share it with one of the two pitching coaches.
But I don't know what the Giants are thinking, and even if I did, I probably don't know enough to judge whether it will work out or not.
In basketball there have been three Warriors moves that I felt strongly about:
The first two were the buying and then selling of the team by the Fitzgerald. He had enjoyed nice success with the Bucks and I felt strongly that he could do the same with the Warriors. When he was bought out by Cohen, I knew little about Cohen but hated to see Fitzgerald go.
The third was the hiring of Jerry West as their consultant. I think Jerry might be the best judge of anyone on the planet. Others may have exulted in the hiring of Steve Kerr.
But when it comes to the Giants, I just don't know enough about the principals, the specifics of their new roles, and their replacements to properly judge.
The one thing it does indicate is that the Giants aren't totally satisfied with the status quo. (How could they be?) Perhaps this is indicative of more changes to come.
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Post by Rog on Oct 22, 2017 12:30:44 GMT -5
When Brian Sabean was hired and in response to criticism replied something to the effect of "I am not an idiot," I thought it showed thin skin and an overreaction. But if "moron, idiot and clueless" are being used now, I don't know.
Maybe we should simply pray that the moves the Giants make this off-season work out as well as the Matt Williams trade. In that move, I think there was some luck involved. I think the Giants felt the primary player in the trade from their standpoint was Julian Tavares, when in reality Jeff Kent was by far the bigger piece. Then again, the Giants may have felt strongly about both players.
For bonus points, anyone know who the other Indian player in the trade was? I don't, and I haven't yet looked it up. If someone can remember, he's a better man than I.
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Post by klaiggeb on Oct 22, 2017 15:17:17 GMT -5
Don't be shy, Rog, call me out by name.
I was the one that printed them.
Then again...I haven't used them yet, Rog.
Not yet.
But if that clown doesn't show me better leadership at the top, then those will be the LEAST of the expletives that fly from my mouth.
Most of my life has been spent in leadership roles, and because of that, I EXPECT better from our GM.
A leader is expected to lead by example, not by the flotsam that comes out of his mouth.
A leader is evaluated not only by his decisions, but by his consistency in his decisions, and by extension, the ability to continually demonstrate leadership qualities.
All I've seen from Evans so far is a guy with a title, nothing more.
The decisions we've seen him make since he took over remind me an awful lot of what we saw from the Dodger organization prior to this off season; foolish, shallow decisions which have less substance that meat.
boly
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Post by Rog on Oct 22, 2017 19:45:10 GMT -5
Here are Bobby Evans' primary moves since being named Giants general manager on April 4, 2015:
July 30, 2015 -- Traded first baseman/outfielder Adam Duvall and pitcher Keury Mella to the Reds for pitcher Mike Leake. Leake was one of the hottest pitchers in baseball at the time of the trade, but he was quickly injured after the trade. Duvall has gone on to have two good seasons for the Reds, playing a nice outfield while hitting over 30 homers each season. Duvall has been aided by playing in the Reds' Park instead of AT&T Park.
Verdict: This trade looked good when it was made. Leake was red hot. With Leake getting injured, the Giants not re-signing him, and Duvall playing two good seasons, the trade worked out very poorly.
August 20, 2015 -- Traded pitcher Stephen Johnson for outfielder Marlon Byrd. Byrd played very well for the Giants but wasn't re-signed. Johnson has been injured and returned to the Giants in 2017.
Verdict: Good trade.
October 23, 2015 -- Signed Gorkys as a free agent.
Verdict: This minor deal has worked out well.
December 9, 2015 -- Signed Jeff Samardzija as a free agent. I didn't like this deal initially, but Samardzija led the National Leaguer in innings pitched in 2017 and has developed trade value.
Verdict: This deal has worked out well if the Giants trade Jeff and receive young value in return.
December 6, 2015 -- Signed Johnny Cueto as a free agent. A very good signing until Johnny's opt out clause became known and he struggled with injury in 2017.
Verdict: This deal started out fabulously with a fine season from Johnny in 2016, but he pitched poorly enough in 2017 that I hope he DOES opt out. Despite the great start to his Giants career, not a good signing thus far.
January 7, 2016 -- Signed Denard Span as a free agent.
Verdict: -- This move has backfired big time.
July 26, 2016 -- Traded Adelberto Mejia for Eduardo Nunez. Mejia become a fifth starter for the Twins, while Nunez battled injuries but played well for the Giants before himself being traded a year later.
Verdict -- So far so good, although this one is pretty close to an even trade at this point.
August 1, 2016 -- Traded Matt Duffy, Lucius Fox and Michael Santos for Matt Moore.
Verdict: So far this trade hasn't worked out for either team. If Fox reaches his potential or Duffy bounces back, the move will be a bad one for the Giants d-- unless Moore bounces back.
August 1, 2016 -- Traded Phil Bickford and Andrew Susac for Will Smith. Smith missed 2017 to Tommy John surgery after pitching well in 2016.
Verdict: I thought the Giants gave up too much for Smith, although I liked him a lot. Bickford and Susac have failed thus far, swinging the deal the Giants' way. This could turn out quite well if Smith pitches well upon his return.
December 5, 2016 -- Signed Mark Melancon as a free agent. Mark missed most of the 2017 season to injury.
Verdict: Kind of an incomplete on this one depending on how effective Melancon is upon his return. Not a good signing thus far.
January 24, 2017 -- Signed Nick Hundley as a free agent.
Verdict: Hundley had a good season for only $2 million. Good signing.
July 22, 2017 -- Signed Pablo Sandoval as a free agent. The Giants got Sandoval back for free.
Verdict -- Incomplete, but no downside.
July 26, 2017 -- Traded Eduardo Nunez for Gregory Santos and Shaun Anderson.
Verdict -- Way too early to judge this, but the Giants took a gamble with Santos and got a safe player in Anderson. The move was panned at the time -- and Nunez performed quite well for the Red Sox when he was healthy -- but given that it was a buyers' I see it as an incomplete with no downside.
August 5, 2017 -- Allowed George Kontos to be picked up on waivers by the Pirates. When healthy, Kontos pitched well for the Pirates.
Verdict: Kontos pitched well for the Pirates when healthy and won't command a huge contract through arbitration, but the Giants wanted to go younger. If the Giants keep going younger, a good result. If not, they may miss Kontos, who was a staple in middle relief for five seasons.
On balance, not looking good for Evans thus far. Injuries to Nunez and particularly Leake hurt. The Giants didn't expect Duvall to play as well as he has.
The Giants really stepped up their rotation with the dual signings of Cueto and Samardzija. Still a lot of risk with another injured player in Cueto, but if he returns strongly, he'll regain some trade value, while Samardzija already has it.
Too early to tell with Bobby, but the early returns aren't promising -- although they don't appear to be as bad as they might appear at first glance.
If Bobby is passive this off-season, I'll turn negative on him. If he is active but makes trades that don't turn out, he would again fall from what little favor he has. But if he shakes it up and forms a younger team, he could move up in my eyes. He's got a very tough job ahead of him, so it's time for him to prove his mettle.
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Post by klaiggeb on Oct 23, 2017 10:12:24 GMT -5
I agree with your assessment, rog; except for the 'too early to tell' part.
For me, he sealed the deal with what I posted in the thread "What's that Smell?"
These firings have told me all I need to know about Bobby E.
And what would that be?
Pass the blame to the guys before 'me,' and start all over with 'my guys,' when he hasn't shown one inkling that he knows how to build a team at all, much less choose the right guys.
Sheesh.
boly
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Post by Rog on Oct 23, 2017 21:44:20 GMT -5
It's time we stop, hey, what's that smell? Everybody look, what's gone to hell.
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Post by Rog on Oct 23, 2017 21:46:51 GMT -5
Staying away from Buffalo, New York and Springfield, Illinois, we don't really know what these moves mean. I believe in giving people the benefit of the doubt until I know better.
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Post by Rog on Oct 23, 2017 22:06:51 GMT -5
Nothing you could say could take me away from my guys (my guys).
Nothing you could do 'cause I'm stuck like glue to my guys (my guys).
I tell you from the start I can't be torn apart from my guys.
As a matter of opinion I think they're tops,
My opinion is they're the cream of the crop.
I'm telling you from the start I can't be torn apart from my guys.
Out with the old, on my guys I am sold,
so I had to let some go, I had to tell 'em no.
It's just not all my fault,
so I've got to put a halt,
Take out all the old, 'cause they're just not in the mold of my guys.
I'm skating all the rap when us the others lap,
I'm turning things around, to my guys I am bound,
(with my guys).
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