I s the outfield on the outs?

[Rog]

After the game today, Marty Lurie spoke about the Giants' thinness in the outfield.  It seems Gorkys Hernandez is almost a foregone conclusion as the backup center fielder (as well as backing up the other two spots).  Marty mentioned Justin Ruggiano, but not as a backup center fielder.  I'm hoping Randy is right that Justin can still play center, since despite his poor spring, he has a track record of hitting southpaws very well.

Marty suggested the Giants look at the waiver wire in an effort to acquire a backup center fielder.  One who could conceivably come available would be Austin Jackson, who signed a minor league contract with the Indians.  Aaron Hicks of the Yankees might be another candidate.   Aaron has a major league contract, but it is for only $1.35 million.

I'm not sure the Yankees have the outfield depth to depart with Hicks, who aside from starting left fielder Brett Gardner is the only backup center fielder listed on the Yankees' depth chart.  The Indians have more depth, perhaps freeing up Jackson.

Neither of these guys is great, but they can both play a decent center field , have experience there, and hit from the right side.

Marty didn't mention platooning.  His point was how thin the Giants were in case of outfield injury.  He didn't think Duggar or Slater would be ready soon.  He pointed out that while the Giants had addressed other situations, they left themselves quite vulnerable in the outfield.

Among the outfielders, Parker, Williamson, Marrero and Morse (an outfielder in a pinch) have had good springs.  The two incumbent starters, Span and Pence, as well as Ruggiano and Hernandez have been awful.

It's beginning to look like the position player roster spots in question may favor Gillaspie (foregone conclusion), Hill, Morse and Hernandez.  Those guys could all make it if the Giants limit themselves to a dozen pitchers.

Among the pitchers, Chris Stratton and Albert Suarez could be battling it out for the long man.  (Cain or Blach could possibly figure in as well.)  David Hernandez hurt himself with a very poor outing this weekend, but he's likely still in the middle relief race along with Corey Gearrin.  Gearrin too has been pretty awful.  Steven Okert looks like he's earning the lefty specialist role.  Throw in mainstays Melancon, the now-healthy Smith, Law, Strickland and Kontos, and the 25-man roster is getting pretty full of pitchers.  Even with 13 pitchers, if the Giants roster a long man, either Hernandez or Gearrin will need to go on the DL or be designated.

If the Giants are comfortable with both Hernandez and Gearrin, one possible move would be to trade Kontos for a right-handed hitting backup outfielder.  Or maybe they could say trade Hernandez or Gearrin for say Austin Jackson in a trade of players who otherwise wouldn't make their respective team's roster.

[Islandboagie]

First off, I'm not a fan of Lurie. His shows is more broad strokes about the Giants and baseball in general, not usually detailed. I would recommend his show to people who don't already have a firm grasp of the game.

But you do bring up a valid point about the depth in CF. A topic I've touched on frequently this off season. I really wanted them to secure a viable option to backup Span if last season was a growing trend in Span's remaining days.

I stated a while ago that Ruggiano can play CF, but probably would be less effective at AT&T.

I suggested the idea that bringing back Pagan or Blanco back for one more season would have been a good idea. Not doing so I believe will bite them in the ass this season.

Just like before last season when I suggested they beef up their bench and bullpen. Those two ended up as being a critical weakness for them.

Again I'll say, I think Steven Duggar might be the savior in CF if Span can't do it anymore.

Duggar put up a .823 OPS last season in Richmond. Duggar has been consistent throughout his minor league career. Based on his OPS in Richmond and his impressive spring, I'd guess Duggar will start in Fresno. If he remains consistent in Fresno he could be ready for a callup if and when Span falters.

I hope I'm wrong, I hope Span kills it, but that's starting to look very unlikely.

I know you're hellbent on this platoon idea with Span, but I just don't see it. Span can't field his position anymore, and if he proves he can't offensively be a legit starter he needs to be benched, or even better, released.

[klaiggeb]

I, too, was one who mentioned last week that there will likely be players available on waivers, or flat out cuts.

Span has started slowly, but I am ZERO concerned.

Let's talk about how he's doing come the end of April and into May before we start playing the funeral dirge.

As far as Hernandez goes, he has CONTINUALLY proven that he cannot hit major league pitching, and if he'd allow, me I'd tell him why.

Three things:

1-Back elbow UP, causing a loop in his swing.

2-Bat straight up in the year at set up, causing, you guessed it, a loop in his swing.

3-No apparent knowledge of what pitch he can handle, much less hit.

boly

boly

[Rog]

I know you're hellbent on this platoon idea with Span, but I just don't see it. Span can't field his position anymore, and if he proves he can't offensively be a legit starter he needs to be benched, or even better, released.


Rog -- First of all, I'm not sure what anyone wouldn't like about Marty. He knows the Giants, and he has a huge library of interviews that he has done with people all the way from old time players to Brandon Belt's college coach. Willie Mays has asked Marty to be the MC for some of the events that feature Willie. But different strokes for different folks.

Now, as for Span.

Denard is two different players, both of whom are about average fielders. The "two" Denards weren't very good fielders the first half of 2016, but "they" got better as the season went along.

But one Denard can hit; the other can't.

The Denard that can hit bats against right-handers. That Denard hit .289 with a .353 OBP. Pretty good for a leadoff man. His .428 SLG was decent too. That guy can lead off for me just about anytime.

The Denard that can't hit bats against southpaws. He hit .217 with a .284 on-base percentage. That's not good enough to play in the majors, especially with only a .283 SLG. That's a .566 OPS.

This is a no-brainer. Denard is OK against right-handers. He's a good enough fielder for a guy who is a good lead off man (against righties). He doesn't belong in the major leagues against southpaws. The WORST-HITTING qualifying center fielder last season was Kevin Pillar (an excellent fielder). His OPS was .679, or well over 100 points HIGHER than Denard against southpaws. Denard against southpaws is unacceptable -- even as a reserve.

If it were just one season, we wouldn't be so worried. But that's about what he has done in three of the last four seasons. And even in the one "good" season he had against southpaws, he didn't reach a .700 OPS.

Boly looked at Denard's career numbers against southpaws. That's not a bad approach. But, remember, stats don't lie -- but they can be misinterpreted. Boly didn't notice that Denard was actually GOOD against southpaws early in his career, but fell off after two good seasons and has been horrible three out of the past four seasons.

Now, Denard COULD bounce back against southpaws, but it doesn't appear likely that he will do so to a big enough extent. The last time he had an OPS above .750 was in 2009. Since then, his OPS has been above .700 only once. Denard is similar to Pablo Sandoval in that he came into the league able to hit southpaws but lost the ability as his career progressed.

Platooning Denard -- assuming there is a capable platoon partner -- is a no-brainer.

I'm happy with the "good" Denard. Yeah, I'd like a better fielder, but he isn't that far off average these days. But I'm not sure the "bad" Denard would succeed in Sacramento.

Don't release Denard. That would be foolish. The "good" Denard isn't bad. Platoon him, putting him in the position to succeed. That's one of the primary jobs of a manager -- to put his players in position to succeed. When Bruce Bochy plays Denard against a right-hander, he's putting him in position to succeed. When he plays him against a southpaw, he's putting him in position to fail.

As I said, it's a no-brainer.



Read more: sfgiantsmessageboard.proboards.com/thread/3774/outfield-on-outs#ixzz4bvT9ZuCm

[Rog]

Steven Duggar has been a pleasant surprise after being drafted out of Clemson in 2015.

[Rog]

You say despite Denard's slow start this spring you have no concern, Boly, but regardless of how he's playing this spring, aren't you concerned about his inability to hit southpaws since 2009?

Denard was a very good hitter against southpaws when he first came up. But over the past seven seasons, he's been poor. That's a very long down period.