Terrible Rumors

[klaiggeb]

Down here behind the 'blue curtain,' rumor has it that the Dodgers are front runners in the race to acquire McCutchen of the Pirates.

I really, REALLY don't want to see that happen.

I mean, really!

The papers here, as well as the local talk shows, are reporting that LA doesn't care one squat how much they have to pay in penalties for being over the salary limit.

If LA gets McCutchen...that, baring injuries, pretty much seals the deal for the NL West.

yeah, yeah, I can hear the arguments already.

But the fact is, adding HIM changes the dynamics of the NL west.

I wish we had the pieces to go get him.

I really do.

With him in CF, Span in LF...we would NOW, and FINALLY have a legit 3 hole hitter.

Talk about line up depth!

Span
Panik
McCutchen
Posey
Pence
Crawford
Belt
Nunez

And THAT would give Bochy the option to do what it seems he wants to do; Hit the pitcher 8th.

Nunez would then assume the role of Pagan from 2016 before it all went terribly wrong.

Heck, with McCutchen, I might change my opinion of a line up, and move Nunez to the 2 hole, and Panik to the 8 hole.

Speed, speed, speed at the top!

Span
Nunez
McCutchen
Posey
Pence
Crawford
Belt
Panik.

and please, I'm begggggggggging you, Bochy do NOT, repeat DO NOT put Nunez and his terrible OBP in the 1 hole!

To score runs, you need BASE RUNNERS!

boly

[Rog]

I certainly wouldn't turn down McCutchen, and I should study him more, but I wouldn't chase him. He hasn't been very good defensively and will likely be moved to a corner. What I would need to examine is whether I would expect him to bounce back strongly. Right now I'm not optimistic.

Could he play for the Giants? Of course. But I'm not sure he'd be anything approaching the addition he would have been two or three years ago.

Incidentally, I wouldn't bat Belt and Panik 7th and 8th. They get on base too much. In that lineup, believe it or not, I'd probably lead off with Panik and bat Belt second. Nunez would make a strong 7th-place hitter, and he and Span could manufacture some runs where they most need to be manufactured -- the bottom of the order.

Now, Panik doesn't have great speed, although he is a good base runner, but if he singles to lead off the game, Belt, McCutchen, Posey and Pence should be able to drive him in more often than not.

I might move Pence up to second, bat Belt third and move back McCutchen and/or Posey -- probably McCutchen, since he wasn't nearly the hitter Belt was last season and at this point in his career probably isn't as good as Posey.

Here's a question I have: If Nunez doesn't get on base enough to lead off, wouldn't the same thing be true batting second? What we want is guys on base for the heart of the order. Nunez's speed might be more valuable near the bottom of the order, where manufacturing runs is more of a priority.

One thing about the Giants' order is that because of the lack of power, it probably would hurt less to pull it out of a hat than other teams, not of course that I'm recommending it. But overall my theory is bat the guys who get on base at the top of the order, put the big boys in the middle and let the speed guys creators who don't get on base enough bat at the bottom of the order where they can manufacture runs, since they won't be creating many with normal hitting.

Incidentally, I certainly wouldn't have Span lead off against southpaws. He simply doesn't get on base often enough against them. Three of the past four seasons his OBP against southpaws has been .278, .279 and .284. The other season it was .337, which is below par but approaching acceptable. If Nunez doesnt get on base enough to lead off, Span CERTAINLY doesn't get on base enough against southpaws.

If Span starts against southpaws at all, he should bat eighth. Perhaps we don't agree whether he's a platoon player, but I hope we can agree that he shouldn't bat LEADOFF against them.

[klaiggeb]

Rog, why are you so fascinated with Belt in the 3 hole?

I am not.

I know you have shown some numbers that seem to "suggest" he can hit there.

I don't believe he can. Not long term.

From my observations, and we've had this conversation before, Belt has too many brain farts to make me comfortable in the 3 hole.

When he's hot, fine... but as I said above, he's not a long term solution.



Secondly, McCutchen bounce back, Rog? He had an off year, but it's not like he's an old geezer like, say... ummmm, me.



I mean, he's only 30, has consistently hit 20+ HRs/season, and other than 2016, has hit at or near .300.

Is there an injury I don't know about?



As to Joey the P.... I love Joey!

He and Pence and Crawford are MY KIND OF PLAYERS!

He gets on base a LOT... and IF we had a power line up, THEN I could see him 1 hole, as the Giants did with Harvey Kuenn in 1962-1964.

Behind Harvey were:

Mays
Cepeda/McCovey
Alou/Hart

With OUR line up, we need guys who can RUN AT THE TOP, and Joey the P is average at best.


The ONLY reason I even SUGGEST Nunez 2 hole for to put the maximum amount of speed at the top.

No way on God's green earth does he EVER, except in an emergency, hit 1 hole.



With OUR lineup, he's okay 2 hole.

Notice I said OKAY. Not what I want there.

I prefer Panik there and Nunez 8.

Why 8? or 9?

He's a free swinger/hacker who constantly expands the strike zone as YOU WANT an 8 hole guy to do.

He's our best choice there but he would brood.

boly



boly

[Rog]

Rog, why are you so fascinated with Belt in the 3 hole?


Rog -- I can see him in a variety of spots, but last season he was the Giants' best hitter, in particular getting on base a lot. Wouldn't you like to have him on base for Posey and Pence -- and in the lineup you mentioned, McCutchen. Maybe I'd bat McCutchen there. He's been successful in the past. It would depend on how well he bounces back. I'll have to look that up to see what I think, and you make a very good point that he may have had an injury or other issue last season.

I'm probably wrong about McCutchen not bouncing back strongly, and I do need to study it more.

It was likely coincidental, but the Giants made their strong run in late September when Brandon was moved to the two-hole. I had mentioned him there before, but he certainly isn't the typical #2 hitter. I do like that he gets on base a lot and doesn't hit into many double plays.

This was a shocker to me and is no doubt based in great part on a small sample size, but Brandon has actually done his best hitting in the cleanup spot. In 33 games there, he has a .995 SLG. Second-best is his .965 SLG batting 2nd. Batting sixth is next at .840, followed by .815 while batting third.

Brandon has batted by far the most in the sixth, fifth or third in his career, in that order. He's hit about the same in each spot, putting up an OPS in the low to mid .800's in each slot. And those are in pretty decent-sized samples.

There is a stat called weighted runs created plus. It is based more or less on how many runs a team would score if that batter were at the plate all the time. 100 is average, and Brandon led the Giants with 138 last season. The thing that Brandon does best is to avoid making outs. He gets a decent amount of hits, walks a lot and hits into very few double plays. A guy with those characteristics should usually bat in the top three, with second or third probably being the best.

I felt Brandon was an easy choice for #3 last season (or #2 I guess). He got on base clearly more than anyone else on the team, and he even led it in extra base hits, home runs and doubles. He was second in triples. When a guy gets on base most often on your team and has the most power, #3 seems like the obvious place to hit him.

Brandon isn't anywhere close to Willie Mays, but those are the primary reasons Willie hit third most of the time.




Read more: sfgiantsmessageboard.proboards.com/thread/3650/terrible-rumors#ixzz4TblzARJH

[Rog]

My quick look at Andrew really doesn't show anything serious that would indicate he won't come back pretty well. He has refused to blame thumb and knee injuries, but perhaps they were a significant part of his decline. Either way, he's been pretty stand up about it.

I need to back off my original comments about Andrew. I might feel differently when I look closer, but my initial thoughts aren't positive, but they also aren't sharply negative. One thing to note is that while his batting dropped off, his home runs really didn't.

It appears he truly dropped off (not simply an unlucky BABIP drop), but not precipitously. His K rate went up, and his BB rate went down Those certainly aren't positive signs, but I'm not sure they're overly alarming at this point. Depth Charts project him as recovering about half the drop, and that was pretty much what my own projection was going to be.

With the exception of maybe a one-season bounce back or something, I think we've seen the best we're going to see from Andrew, but I think he can still hit -- just not as well as previously. His fielding and base running appear to have fallen off last season. I wonder if that makes it more likely he WAS injured a bit.

As you mentioned, Boly, he's only 30, but his defensive decline in particular is concerning. Maybe injuries do explain most of it, in which case he could bounce back more than halfway.

Andrew is under team control for two years, and given how strong the 2019 free agent class may be, he could be less unreasonable to sign or re-sign than some other good players.

But I think MVP contender Andrew is likely gone.

[Rog]

The only caveat I would give to the above is that if Andrew's problems stemmed from injury, obviously I would be more optimistic. And that quite possibly is the case.

One thing about Andrew is that at less then $30 million over the next two seasons, he's quite reasonably priced.

[rxmeister]

Funny thing that out on the west coast you're hearing the Dodgers will get McCutcheon, but here in NYC we're hearing it's the Mets. It's a question of whether the Mets will include Steven Matz in the deal. I've heard the Dodgers are far more interested in Brian Dozier, as are the Giants. Unfortunately the Dodgers have the better prospects to make either move. I've heard the Dodgers are willing to include DeLeon in a Dozier deal, and he's major league ready and better than any pitcher in the Giants organization at this time. If I was going to predict, I think the Dodgers get Dozier, and Cutch stays in Pittsburgh.

[Islandboagie]

I don't think the Giants could put together a package that would interest the Pirates enough to land McCutchen.

Also, I don't think you need to worry, Boly, what I'm seeing is the Mets are the front runners for him, not the Dodgers.

If the Giants were able to land him, I would bat him leadoff or 2nd.

[klaiggeb]

Sure hope you and Mark are right, Boagie.

I'm hearing the same stories, though, about Dozier...


I don't think we have a package that could get McCutchen either.

Then again, I can't help but wonder what a package like our top pitching prospect, AND Arroyo AND either Parker or Williamson would be enticing to Pittsburgh who has a number of holes to fill.

That RF porch would like VERY GOOD to a pull guy like Parker and Pittsburgh.

boly

[Rog]

If I was going to predict, I think the Dodgers get Dozier, and Cutch stays in Pittsburgh.


Rog -- Darn, Mark. You're so right on the money again. Don't know for sure it will turn out that way, but it certainly is the way things are looking right now.

Do you think the Pirates will land Quintana?





Read more: sfgiantsmessageboard.proboards.com/thread/3650/terrible-rumors#ixzz4ThSH3L9r

[Rog]

Then again, I can't help but wonder what a package like our top pitching prospect, AND Arroyo AND either Parker or Williamson would be enticing to Pittsburgh who has a number of holes to fill.


Rog -- Christian Arroyo and Tyler Beede are tempting prospects, but I'm not sure both of them together equals the appeal of Jose De Leon of the Dodgers. Parker or Williamson might have SOME appeal to another team, but I would think they would prefer one of the Giants' younger outfield prospects.

Notice that the big trades for prospects this off-season -- such as Chris Sale and Adam Eaton from the White Sox -- have involved VERY TOP prospects, and the Giants don't have any. For Eaton of all people, the Nationals gave up the #3 prospect overall (and top pitching prospect)plus another couple of top prospects. For Sale, the Red Sox gave up the #1 prospect in the game, plus another top 50 prospect and others. The Giants don't HAVE a top 50 prospect to deal.

I mentioned in another post that we shouldn't be criticizing the Giants for what they have done and haven't done in the past 13 months. I don't like all of it, but they've done a TON. If we're going to criticize, we should wish there were better prospects for Randy to watch in San Jose. It's no longer quite like April 10, 2009 when Madison Bumgarner pitched to Buster Posey for the first time in their minor league careers. I hope Randy was at that game. If not, he might not have been paying close enough attention.

[Rog]

I was just looking at John Sickels' 100 top prospects at the end of 2016, and the Dodgers had the #5, #18, #38, #55, #60 and #78 prospects, each of whom ranked ahead of Christian Arroyo at #95. I've seen both Arroyo and Tyler Beeded ranked a little higher, but the point is that the Giants just don't have all that much in the way of top prospects to trade. And no doubt they'd like to keep some of the prospects such as Arroyo and Beede, who might arrive as soon as 2017 and will likely arrive at least by 2018.

The Giants do have a fair number of outfielders in their top 10 or 20 prospects, and all three outfield positions are likely to be open by two years from now. It would be timely if a few of those outfielders could move into the top five prospects or so within the next year or two.

If we go back to the trade deadline, the Giants made a real coup when they traded for Matt Moore. They gave up Matt Duffy, of course, and Lucius Fox is a very young player with potential, but I'm not sure we appreciate how tough it must have been to pick up the well-controlled Moore given the dearth of free agent starting pitching this winter. Remember, Moore went 17-4 with a 3.29 ERA back in 2013.

Winning record has a lot to do with run support (and Moore got a spectacular 5.57 runs of support that season), but as good as Madison Bumgarner and Johnny Cueto are, their best won-loss records have been 18-9, 2015, 4.31 runs of support for Madison and 18-5, last season, 4.82 runs of support for Johnny.

We've talked about how the Giants have built their team around top 10 prospects such as Tim Linceum, Madison Bumgarner and Buster Posey. None of them was ranked as highly as Moore was before the 2012 season. Matt was ranked #2 by Baseball America and #1 by MLB.com and BaseballProspectus.com. Moore does come with Tommy John surgery in 2014, but he has a better prospect pedigree than any other Giant.

Getting him with what the Giants had to give was a top-notch move. I do find it ironic that some who chastise the Giants for not trading for a closer seem to forget that without Moore's excellent performance in Game 4 against the Cubs, it might not have mattered if the Giants had a closer or not.

I find it vexing that some claim that trading for a closer was the Giants' ONLY high priority. In reality, they had a few. Who knows? They might even have acquired a capable closer, but Bruce Bochy seemed un-WILL-ing to use him in that role.

One thing the Giants have done is develop some good players who weren't top prospects. Let's hope that a year from now the Giants have half a dozen or so of the top 100 and that perhaps Arroyo and Beede are in the top 25.

[klaiggeb]

IMHO, IF.... and I mean IF... the Giants turn out to be one of the top teams in 2017, other than staying healthy... which brought us to our knees these last 2 years, the acquisition of Cueto, Samardizja, and as important, Moore, last year, will, again IMHO, be 3 of the BIGGEST reasons.

I say this with the following in mind: IF.....

1-Samardizja HAS learned his lesson that you just can't throw heat

2-Moore is 100% recovered from his surgery...

... we are 4 deep in quality starters.

Then who is the 5th guy is moot. Cain or Beede or whom ever.

Most teams can't run out 4 quality arms like that.

And in ANY 3 game series, you're going to have to face 2 of them at the very least!


Again, IF 1 & 2 above hold true...we're in great shape.



Now to be sure, there ARE other questions to be answered. Big questions:

1-The bullpen before Meloncon

2-LF IF we stay healthy, this could be a moot point

3-Panik. Joe got hit in the head and as I pointed out at the time, frequently players never regain what they were prior to that moment. Three examples:

1-Paul Blair
2-Don Wert
3-Robby Thompson

4-CF. Span. He must revert to what he was prior to his 'hip' thing.


Lots of ifs.

Then again, most teams have so many more "ifs" than we do.

We'll see.

boly

[Islandboagie]

Not sure if all of you heard, but the Giants just signed our old buddy Michael Morse, and Justin Ruggiano to minor league deals.

Morse is a long shot to find his way onto the 25 man roster because he is primarily a first baseman now, but Ruggiano might be a nice addition to our depth in the outfield.

[klaiggeb]

Hadn't heard that, Boagie.

In fact, I didn't even see it on the Giant website.

Where'd you hear/read that?

I agree with you on both points, by the way.

boly

[Rog]

No question the Giants could use right-handed power off the bench, but Morse seems a reach. He'd likely be just a pinch hitter and little more. Still, very low-risk move, so why not? The Giants know he fits in the clubhouse, and he could conceivably become the righty off the bench to complement Conor Gillaspie from the left.

The move that gets me going more than Morse or Rollins though is Justin Ruggiano. He'll be 35 around the start of the season and appears to be slowing down, but he's another right-handed hitter who has played center field. I hate to belabor the point, but if all starting pitchers were left-handed, Denard Span might well be out of game, at least at the major league level.

Can anyone make a case why we should expect anything over a .650 OPS from Denard against southpaws this season? I think it is more likely he will be below .600 than above .650. Even if he reaches .650, that's nearly 100 point below what the average center field hits over the course of the season.

Ruggiano is far from the perfect platoon partner. He's getting a little long in the tooth and heavy of leg to play center field, especially in AT&T Park, but once again, he's extremely low-risk.
.
Another long-shot for platooning would be Austin Slater, the Giants' 8th-round pick in 2014 out of Stanford. Slater is primarily a second baseman but has also played some outfield, including a touch of center. Splitting the season between Richmond and Sacramento last season, Slater hit over .300 with an OPS approaching .900.

I'm still hoping the Giants will sign or trade for someone like Ben Revere (who just signed), but batting from the right-hand side.

As for seeing this stuff, MLB Trade Rumors is the place to keep up with the Giants' and every other team's moves and possible moves. If you go to the right-hand side and scroll down a little, the articles are broken out by team.

So there's a tiny Christmas present for everyone. Have a wonderful Christmas Day!

[klaiggeb]

Can't make a case for last season, Rog, but historically, Span hasn't been bad.

Rog, you always like to look up what a player has done, and until last year, coming off an injury, Span was a guy I would have thought you'd be talking up and not talking down.

But for some reason, you've got him in your sights this off season, and I don't understand why.

it's not like he's an old guy, he's 32.

Career, total plate appearances vs LHP 1487

vs LHP OBP .342

Batting average vs LHP .266

He has roughly had 1/3 of his PA vs LHP, and when I look at his extra base hits, they are darned close!

Extra base hits vs LHP 5.8%
vs RHP 7.9%

Yes, it's a 2% difference, but it's NOT enough to start platooning the guy.

Now, OBP

Over all, career wise, .350

Vs LHP .342

Vs RHP .353

Again, very close.

I don't think you have a case here, Rog, for wanting to platoon the guy.

I think he deserves more than a fair chance to PROVE he can return to what he was before the hip injury.

boly

[Islandboagie]

I agree, Boly. I'm sure Bochy will give Span a chance to play everyday despite Rog's platoon theory.

If we see more of the same that we saw last season I don't even want him platooned, I want him on the bench or better yet, released. A leadoff/centerfielder that can't get on base and has sub-par range has no value anywhere.

[klaiggeb]

Agree, boagie, I agree.

He deserves the chance to PROVE he's healthy... and if he finally us, what a bonus for us!

boly

[Rog]

Let me start with Boagie's comments.

First, you're right that if Denard Span performs as well next season or better than last year, Bruce Bochy will start him almost every day next season. The question is whether or not Bruce SHOULD do so. And that depends on whom he could platoon him with. Let's suppose that he does, which is why I want the Giants to pick up or develop a satisfactory platoon partner (which could possibly be either Gorkys Hernandez of Justin Ruggiano).

You say that if Denard plays as he did last season, you don't want him to start at all. Against right-handed pitching, I'm fine with him starting. After all, his OBP last season against right-handers was .353, and that's more than acceptable. His SLG was .428. Again, no problem. You and I disagree in that I DO want the Denard Span of last season to start against right-handers.

Just not against southpaws. Why? Last season Denard's OBP against lefties was just .282. Unless he has TREMENDOUS power or some other exceptional attribute or combination of them, that's not going to cut it. I agree with you. I want THAT guy released. But that's not the total Denard. The total Denard from last season should have been platooned. In other words, against right-handers, he should have started. Against left-handed pitchers, he should have been "released," or practically speaking, benched.

Boly makes a good point when he says that the CAREER Span is OK to play every day. And he's right. Denard hasn't been that bad against lefties over his career. In fact, prior to 2013, he hit BETTER against southpaws.

But that doesn't appear to be who he IS anymore. Over the past four seasons combined, he had a combined OPS below .600 against southpaws. THAT's the guy Boagie wants released or benched.

The question becomes what we can expect from Denard against southpaws in 2017. Should we expect his career average? Probably not. He hasn't been anything close to that guy in three of the past four seasons. He did OK against right-handers those four season, but he was terrible overall against southpaws. The guy should be platooned.

Would I platoon him right out of the chute? No. I'd give him a shot against southpaws. Maybe he'll bounce back to his previous form (although Pablo Sandoval, another player I called a platoon player, certainly hasn't). The Giants are REALLY lucky they didn't pay $95 million to a platoon player, although I think he'll be OK against right-handers this year.

But we're not talking about Pablo; we're discussing Span. Give him the everyday shot, and if he doesn't show fairly quickly that he can once against hit southpaws, platoon him. I expect Bruce to be more patient than I would be, but I would have patience for a month or two.

I ask you, Boly, why you expect Denard to hit OK against southpaws this season. Certainly he MIGHT. But his history over the past four seasons, which is more likely to predict his 2017 performance than previous seasons which are now well in the past, says he isn't likely to do so.

If Denard can once again become the career Span against southpaws, he deserves to play. If not, he deserves to be platooned. The odds appear to be "not."

[klaiggeb]

Rog-I ask you, Boly, why you expect Denard to hit OK against southpaws this season. Certainly he MIGHT. But his history over the past four seasons, which is more likely to predict his 2017 performance than previous seasons which are now well in the past, says he isn't likely to do so.

***boly says****

The bigger question, Rog, based upon your history of researching a player's career and encouraging me to look at his over all numbers, is WHY you don't think he WILL revert to what he once was?

He's had one bad season, and THAT season, most likely, can be attributed to his NOT being 100% healthy.

Surgery cuts into muscles, and muscles don't necessarily come back to what they were right away.

Look at Tommy John surgery-pitchers. Takes them almost 2 full years to get back to what they once were.

Thus my logic concerning Span.

He had surgery.

He wasn't fully 100%

So why shouldn't we expect a return to full health?

Rog I've never seen you so down on a player with so little reason before.

This is not like you, and I have to wonder why.

boly

[Rog]

The bigger question, Rog, based upon your history of researching a player's career and encouraging me to look at his over all numbers, is WHY you don't think he WILL revert to what he once was?

He's had one bad season, and THAT season, most likely, can be attributed to his NOT being 100% healthy.

Surgery cuts into muscles, and muscles don't necessarily come back to what they were right away.

Look at Tommy John surgery-pitchers. Takes them almost 2 full years to get back to what they once were.

Thus my logic concerning Span.

He had surgery.

He wasn't fully 100%

So why shouldn't we expect a return to full health?

Rog I've never seen you so down on a player with so little reason before.

This is not like you, and I have to wonder why.


Rog -- I'm not really down on Denard, although I would have liked to see the Giants do better than him.

And while he didn't reach our expectations, he didn't have a horrible season last year. Offensively, he was a bit better than he had been in 2010 and 2011.

Plus, as you say, he was coming off three injuries in one year and may well improve this coming season. In fact, I think he will do so.

So why you say, is Rog so down on Denard? Has he gone looney tunes?

Well, I don't think so. I'm all for Denard against right-handers. Heck, he was fine against them last season. .289 batting with a fine .353 OBP and a more than decent .428 SLG. That's a .783 OPS, and I'll take that easily.

But against southpaws he was lousy. A .284 OBP for crying out loud. That's horrible for an eight-place hitter, let alone a lead off man. Yet that was one point higher than his SLG. Are you kidding me? That's not even a Four A player. It's AAA or Double A. Maybe even High A. Denard's OPS against southpaws was .566.

We're criticizing Brandon Belt, who posted a team-leading .868 OPS, and yet we're willing to tolerate Denard against southpaws? Denard's OPS against lefties was more than 300 points lower than Belt's against all pitchers.

Let's say the Giants have a shot at getting a new center fielder who the past three seasons has hit .223 with a .539 OPS, .269 with a .694 OPS, .197 with a .542 OPS, and .217 with a .566 OPS. Would we want him? Of course not. We wouldn't even want him on the team, and we might not even be willing to give him a minor league contract.

Yet that's Denard the past four seasons against southpaws. That's why I see him as just a platoon player. I said I would give him a month or two to prove me wrong, and then I would platoon him. Under the circumstances, that's being pretty generous. You are right when you say he might return to his career mark of .266 with a .695 OPS. But it appears in 2014 when he hit .269 with a .694 OPS against southpaws, he may have had his final spurt year against them.

Remember how I said before Pablo Sandoval didn't re-sign that he was a platoon player despite a career mark against southpaws of somewhere around .270 batting average with an OPS of around .700? Sounds kind of like Span's .266 with a .695 OPS, doesn't it? Well, Pablo put up a .197 average with a .465 OPS in 2015, immediately after the Giants lucked out by not signing him. He did OK against righties, batting .266 with a .744 OPS. Not great, but somewhat acceptable. Not quite as good as Denard's .289 with a .781 OPS last season, but similar.

I have no problem with Denard's playing against right-handers. Heck, he even stole nine bases in 12 attempts against them. But he couldn't hit southpaws at all, and he stole only three bases in seven attempts.

You are right that Bruce Bochy will likely play Denard most of the time against lefties. But that's just stupid. Give him a month or two to show he can still hit them, and if not, find someone who can platoon with him. Three out of the past four seasons Denard has KILLED his team against southpaws. And was while he was hitting righties just fine.

Denard was once a decent hitter against southpaws. But his past four season have combined to be atrocious.

I didn't like Denard's defense last season, but I felt he did improve as the season went on. And it hasn't been too many years since he was considered a good or even very good center fielder. I think I may have recommended the Giants sign him four years ago when he instead signed with the Nationals. That may not have been a brilliant recommendation on my part, but he earned his (lesser) salary with Washington. Hopefully he will do so with the Giants, but it is unlikely to happen if he can't learn to hit southpaws again.

The guy I wanted a year ago was Dexter Fowler. He has hit southpaws at a .302/.835 clip. His .255/.770 against right-handers has been about as good as Denard's. Denard has hit for a higher average against righties but hasn't gotten on base more or hit for a higher slugging percentage.

I wouldn't count Denard out against southpaws, but I would need fairly high odds to be for him. Against righties, he's OK right now. But he's got Pablo Sandoval syndrome against lefties. Not as bad, but certainly not good.

Read more: sfgiantsmessageboard.proboards.com/thread/3650/terrible-rumors#ixzz4U07YcAhM