Giants to sign closer, play Mac and Parker in left

[Rog]

Bobby Evans on KNBR yesterday said the Giants were going hot and heavy after a closer, but continued to indicate they do plan to go with the duo of Mac Williamson and Jarrett Parker in left.  Evans said that a team sometimes needs to give its young players a chance.

He did indicate the Giants might go for some depth in the outfield and implied they might also add another reliever.

Bobby has been accused here of lying to us, but he said he would rather miss out on a deal than lie.  He was speaking of lying to another GM, not to us, but as usual he took lots of time before answering questions, appearing to want to not give out too much information but not lie either.

Gary Radnich said that Evans and Stever Kerr were guys you would want to leave your kids with, indicating both were of good character.

[Rog]

Evans also indicated nothing was imminent, but said that during the winter meetings (next week), he was usually able to get about two weeks of work done in three and a half days.

[Rog]

The Giants continue to be mentioned with regard to closer Mark Melancon -- and to outfielder J.D. Martinez. I realize I just posted that Bobby said the Giants wanted to give the two (fairly) young left fielders a shot, but I also just remembered two other things he said.

First -- and this would indeed lean toward Williamson and Parker -- he mentioned that the Giants could address left field at the deadline if necessary.

Second -- and this might point toward the possibility of Martinez -- he said the Giants didn't want to go LONG-TERM with an outfielder. Martinez has just one more season on his contract before being eligible for free agency. It seems possible that if the Giants were to trade for Martinez, Evans would point out that with the injury history of Pence and Span, there would likely still be opportunities for the two youngsters.

My sense is that the Giants would like to give the two guys a shot, but that they would like even better to have Martinez if they could pick him up reasonably. The luxury tax threshold will rise to $195 million in 2017, and while the Giants are said to be one of five teams to reach the threshold last season, they might be able to fit in both a front-weighted contract for Melancon and the $11.5 million owed to Martinez for 2017.

Evans mentioned former first round pick right-handed starter Chris Stratton when asked who has impressed this winter in the Arizona Fall League or in winter ball. When asked which players other teams asked about in trades, he said Christian Arroyo and Tyler Beede, generally considered the Giants' top two prospects.

Evans mentioned that the Giants had control over both Pence and Span for two more seasons and said they had outfield prospects "a little further away" who might complement that time table.

Evans indicated the Giants were building around Bumgarner, Posey and the two Brandon's. He didn't mention Joe Panik, but I would think Joe is in the core too. In fact, perhaps he did mention Joe, although I don't think so and seem to remember that I was surprised he didn't.

[Rog]

The Giants are said in MLB Trade Rumors (pretty close to a must-read in the off-season) to have talked to representatives of each of the top three closers. Trade Rumors mentioned Giants reliever Cory Gearrin as a possible non-tender candidate. Gearrin is expected to receive an estimated $1.1 million in arbitration.

Jon Heyman says the Giants are interested in free agent outfielder Dexter Fowler, although that doesn't seem to fit with what Bobby Evans said yesterday with regard to no long-term outfield contracts. Fowler is said to be looking for $18 million annually on a multi-year contract.

[Rog]

Ehire Adrianza has signed a split contract paying him $600 K in the majors and $300 K in the minors.

[rxmeister]

Yeah, Bobby is lying to us and other teams because he's very interested in JD Martinez. Showing desperation is a bad thing in negotiations so Bobby is right to go low key and pretend he's happy with Mac/Parker in left. They'll still play a prominent role next year as players need rest, and both Span and Pence have tough times staying healthy. I've heard it's coming down to the Giants and Nationals for Melancon, and most expect him to be the first of the closers to sign. I'd be looking at Jansen, but I can understand the reluctance to both pay the higher price and forfeit a number one pick. Under the new CBA you won't forfeit your first round pick, so this is the last year to worry about that

[sfgdood]

on the cheap yet again

[klaiggeb]

I don't see Martinez as "on the cheap," Randy.

I see him as a pretty decent fit.

boly

[sfgdood]

Just like the false rumor about the Giants going after top international talent, I don't believe a word of the Martinez crap. Let's see them prove me wrong for once

[Rog]

on the cheap yet again


Rog -- You're truly a broken record. So rather than listen to the record over again ... over again ... over again ... let's look at the pertinent facts we know.

It has been reported that the Giants have talked to representatives for each of the top three closers. It is estimated that they will go for close to 4/$60 (Melancon) or above. That's not exactly cheap.

The Giants are said to be very interested in J.D. Martinez, who would immediately become the most powerful hitter on the team and who hits for average too. Does that sound like an el cheapo move?

One last point. The Giants are said to be one of five teams that exceeded the luxury tax threshold last season. Does that sound cheap?

So I guess we can keep calling out cheap, cheap, cheap. Or we can look at the facts.

[rxmeister]

Giants signed Lucius Fox, who was considered the best of the young international talent, and even though they subsequently traded him away, it certainly was a pretty big investment. Going for Melancon is a top of the line investment too, as you'll see when he signs. According to people in the know, it's between the Giants, Nats and Cubs for his services and the Giants at this point are the highest bidder. You hear that, Randy? The highest bidder! I would think if the Nats come close he'll stay where he is, because he liked it there, but the Giants are giving it their best shot. Right now the bidding is supposedly higher than 4/60.

[sfgdood]

It is rumored...there have been talks...blah blah blah. Action talks and bullshit blows two straight 9th inning leads in the playoffs. The Giants haven't been close to signing a proven international stud, haven't been close to signing a top FA bat and more and more it seems like Parker and Williamson will be our most likely LFers in 2017. I'm SICK of it. The FO needs to grow some gonads and get us what we need, no matter what the cost.

[Rog]

The FO needs to grow some gonads and get us what we need, no matter what the cost.


Rog -- You're in a fantasy world. Even the Dodgers are cutting back on salaries. The Giants have been in the top five team in spending the past two seasons, and yet you're not satisfied.

Not only is overspending unbusinesslike, it doesn't guarantee a World Championship.

Thnk about what you have posted here this offseason, Randy. Virtually nothing positive. When asked for something of substance, you remain silent.

You are now telling the front office what they should do. I'm going to suggest what you do. Be thankful the Giants have been the most successful team this decade in terms of World Championships. Be thankful the Giants spent over a quarter of a million dollars last winter. Be thankful that while they admittedly didn't press as hard for a closer at the trade deadline as they now wish, they traded for a top lefty reliever, an All-Star third baseman, and a very solid third starter (even though they already had one).

Be thankful they are going to solve the closer problem this winter, likely spending around $60 million or more to do so. Be thankful that if they don't solve the left field problem from within or without, they'll very likely address it at the 2017 trade deadline.

Does that mean you should just sit back, ignore what happens this offseason and know the Giants will solve all their problems and magically go on to win it all this year? Of course not. That's not realistic, and it isn't what we should expect from a fan. But instead of saying "woe is me," follow along and see what happens.

Share with us your realistic ideas. Right now you're a fan in denial. You're seemingly unwilling to put thought into what the Giants should realistically do to improve themselves.

Stop and think about it, Randy. Virtually all you do is complain. Instead of being a good fan, you are taking the easy way out. What is the last creative idea you have offered on this board?

Try being positive and/or realistic instead of being a downer.

You have a brain. We've seen it here. It seems like we once saw it a lot. Now you seem to be refusing to use that brain and instead are wallowing in fan self-pity.

As you just said: Action talks and bull blows. Right now you're simply blowing. You're better than that, Randy. If you weren't, we would simply ignore you.




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[sfgdood]

Oh grow up. Of course Im grateful for what the team accomplished this decade. But that doesn't mean I'm going to act like a Pollyanna after the past 3 miserable years. I want to see urgency when it's warranted. I want management to use money for stud FA hitters rather than lining their pockets. You may be happy with these last few years but personally I'm PISSED. I want to see some pro-active action rather than waiting and seeing what happens.

As for me wasting my time coming up with solutions, my answer is pay me what Evans gets, then I'll put effort into it. Any moron can see the glaring needs...Closer and LF. It's Evans job--not mine--to fill those holes. I as a fan have a right to EXPECT better than Williamson and Parker because the money is available to fill both needs on the FA market.

[sfgdood]

make that the past TWO miserable years...it just seems like 3

[rxmeister]

Last offseason the Giants gave Johnny Cueto 6/130 and Jeff Samardzija 5/90. How is that being cheap? And last year was definitely NOT miserable. They made the playoffs and won the wildcard game. You sound like a pompous Yankee fan from back in the day winning championship after championship and then whining the one year they didn't.

[Rog]

The Giants are believed to be leading in the Mark Melancon chase, although it is also being reported that Melancon already has three offers north of 4/$60. Those are believed to have come from the Giants and the Nationals, with the Marlins now being viewed as the surprise third team. The guess is that the bidding may get as high as 4/$65 or 4/$70.

The Marlins are also said to be offering 5/$80 to Kenley Jansen, who unlike Melancon or Aroldis Chapman will require draft pick compensation to the Dodgers, which makes it even worse. Jansen was originally estimated by MLB Trade Rumors to get a 5/$85 offer, and many players (including Melancon) are finding that their offers are exceeding estimates.

Observers believe that the Giants will be able to deliver on their goal of signing one of the top relievers, although clearly it will be very costly, perhaps costlier than originally estimated. The highest previous offer to a closer, 4/$50 to Jonathan Papelbon, will be blown out of the water by each of this year's trio.

Free agents, particularly pitchers and even more particularly relievers, are risky endeavors. The cost of an added win is considered to be $8 million, in part made so high because many costly free agents don't pan out. The Giants themselves have been burned by Barry Zito and Aaron Rowand.

Thus, signing a free agent isn't anything close to a guarantee of significant improvement, particularly in the late years of a long-term contract. Trades don't always work either, but the Royals are said to be shopping Wade Davis, another elite closer.

The chances appear to be above 90% that the Giants will acquire a top closer, and there is a small chance it could come via trade. Be ready, since with the winter meeting underway, there is a decent chance the closer situation will come to a head this week for the Giants.

Oh, and it is believed that Aroldis Chapman will received the highest offer of the trio, although is $100 million request seems to be in danger.

[Rog]

To focus solely on missing out on a closer at last season's trade dealine while ignoring that the Giants turned over about 40% of their key players in adding Johnny Cueto, Jeff Samardzija, Denard Span, Matt Moore, Eduardo Nunez and Will Smith is myopic.

Ironically, in Smith, the Giants likely DID add a top left-hander who could be a respectable closer, only to ignore him in that role all the way to blowing a three-run, ninth-inning lead to end their playoff season.

[Rog]

As for me wasting my time coming up with solutions, my answer is pay me what Evans gets, then I'll put effort into it. Any moron can see the glaring needs...Closer and LF. It's Evans job--not mine--to fill those holes.

Rog -- The logic seems to be there, alright. But covered up is that to blatantly criticize something that is still in process without offering any solutions is cowardly and/or lazy. Thus far you have worked overtime at what you admit any moron could do, while continuing to be figuratively part of the problem while not offering reasonable solutions.




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[Rog]

I believe I read earlier this winter that the Giants entered the postseason with more salary committed than any other team in baseball. If that isn't being cheap, I don't know what is.

[sfgdood]

A millionaire can more easily afford what middle class citizens cannot. Expectations and cheapness are relative terms. Obviously the current methods are falling short. Time to step things up, unless being a wild card team is good enough for you. To me it in't.

[sfgdood]

And btw, Rx...we SHOULD be like those Yankee fans in their dynasty days. When you win, your fans' expectations are naturally raised, particularly when your revenue is in the elite class.

[Rog]

Obviously the current methods are falling short.


Rog -- You're talking about player acquisition, and the facts don't support that. Bruce Bochy's use of his bullpen in the ninth inning of game four fell short, but with the best reliever in the game over the previous 50 days or so, it's hard to argue that he simply didn't make the best use of his resources.

The Giants had the players to enter the ninth inning of game four with a 90% chance to play a game five, and have one of the top five pitchers of this decade pitching for them.

If we're going to blame the Giants for their failure this past postseason, let's put the blame where it belongs -- on Bruce Bochy, not Bobby Evans.

Let's not forget that I didn't like the Smith deal. I thought the Giants gave up too much to get him. But apparently unlike Bruce, I appreciated Smith's value. Down the stretch, Will was clearly a better pitcher than Mark Melancon.

If we look at what Evans did over the past year to improve the Giants' chances, we should be very impressed. If we look at how Bochy used the assets he was provided, we should perhaps be less so. Overall, I think Bruce did OK. But he certainly appears to have significantly underutilized Will Smith.

With Smith and Derek Law now backing up Melancon, next year's bullpen looks promising.