Giants, Game 1: What to like, what to be concerned about

[klaiggeb]

As much as I criticize our players, and I do because I have lofty expectations from professionals, especially veterans, I also know there is a LOT to like about our team;

Thus, this is my perspective; these are my observations prior to game 1.

1-Bullpen- I've been highly critical of Lopez especially, but honestly, this is a deep, solid bunch. Romo has clearly DEMONSTRATED over the last month that he's fixed his mechanical problems, and now is close to the force he once was.

And Casilla... though he got way toooooo amped with Harper at the plate, over throwing 3 consecutive breaking balls... this guy is still another with ice water in his veins! Can't ask for much more.

2-Starters-Hard NOT to be impressed by our big three: Bumgarner, Peavy, Hudson. Hard not to. And, when you add the fact that Vogey has allowed 1 earned run or LESS, in 5 CONSECUTIVE starts... well, you really have to say that these guys as a whole, maybe not THE best staff over all, are awfully darned good.

I simply LOVE Peavy's fire! Love it!
I love Bumgarner's intensity. NOTHING seems to rattle him.
I love Hudson's pitching smarts. Up, down, in out. The guy KNOWS how to pitch.
Vogey. Focus and Heart. I can't say enough about his focus and his heart. Before the game, I thought last night was an AWFUL match up for us... that he'd get clobbered!
But he proved me SOOOO wrong, and I was SOOOo glad!

3-Belt-Struggled in game 4, but Brandon is back to close to what he was before his first injury. I think he's demonstrated that he's a clutch performer many times, most recently in the 18thing with that bomb to RF

4-Panik-Soft, soft hands in the field. Maybe not the best range in MLB, but it's good enough! In fact, when that last ball of the game was hit to him, I NEVER, not for a second, doubted that he'd field it smoothly and make a solid throw.

They kid ADJUSTED big time in game 4 to how he was being pitched! And in stressful situations... you'd never know it. They kid has his emotions under control!

5-SS-Crawford put together a nice offensive September, and that has continued into the playoffs. He continually amazes me in the field with the plays he makes. He IS prone to streaks of bad glove work... but that, I believe, comes when he's tired. And right now, he AIN'T tired.

3B-Sandoval Wouldn't be here without his at bat in game 2. We wouldn't be. He absolutley exasperates me when he's ridiculously aggressive, but the guy can hit, and the guy CAN pick 'em at 3B. If he doesn't win the gold glove, he'll be a close second. I hit him 5th behind Belt, and Posey

LF-The SF Giant's black hole. Morse' timing WILL BE OFF, of that we can be sure. You can't have NOT played since August and be sharp. You can't. His defense WILL BE A QUESTION especially when Bumgarner pitches because of all the RHB that will be in the line up.

Ishi performed admirably out there. He did. And with the bat, he did okay. Harper robbed him in game 3... but he can play

Perez? Can I take the 5th?

Brown? I don't think he'll be on the roster. I think it'll be Morse. At least, at the moment, that's what I'd do. IF we make it to the world series, Morse is my DH.

CF-Blanco can play defense, that's for sure! He really took charge out there last night. Impressed the crap outta me! And with the bat, he did what I think he SHOULD be doing more often; hitting the ball on the ground. Which he did. Once for a single up the middle, once on a ground ball to 1B

RF-Pence. Sheesh! Plays in the ugliest manner I've ever seen. But heart? Holy cow! I don't care what he looks like. I don't care how awkward he seems, he can play for me any day!

C-Posey-This guy showed me eleventeen hundred percent improvement in blocking balls in the dirt. Wow! That's how he should be playing all the time.
I STILL would NOT hit him third, but the guy can HIT! I'd rather Belt or Pence in front of him. Maybe he didn't drive in any runs last night, but it wasn't for lack of effort. He hit the ball hard, and 2 fell.

Anyway, those are my thoughts.

boly

[sfgdood]

if I were a Cards fan I'd be very concerned about Adam Wainwright's health. There's a question about whether he'll make his game 1 scheduled start. His elbow has been barking and he got rocked in his one start against the Dodgers. If Adam aint right, the Giants will have a huge edge in Starting pitching.

[klaiggeb]

Yeah... I just heard that this morning, Randy.

Matheney was on ESPN, and though he didn't go into specifics, he said that for the past month Wainwright has gone out there with what he called a "dead arm."

Sure hope you're right!

boly

[islandboagie]

I'm surprised at you, Boly.

There are certain players who disrespect the game whom I wish ill. Puig and Hanley Ramirez top the list. There are players that disrespect their opponents like Harper and Prince Fielder to name a few who I have no problem wishing ill.

Adam Wainwright I believe is at the other end of the spectrum, the same class act that the Giants players have adopted. Myself, I wish no ill on any of the Cardinals. They respect the game, they respect their opponents, and they should receive the same respect.

I hope both teams are healthy and play as an exciting series as we saw in 2012, with the same result, of course.

[klaiggeb]

Boagie, I'm confused. What are you surprised at?

I didn't rip Wainwright. All I did was post what Matheny said. And Matheny said he had a dead arm.

I have the UTMOST respect for Adam! As you said, he is one CLASS ACT! As are the vast majority, if not all, of the Cardinals.

When I said "I sure hope you're right" my comment was NOT intended as a knock, or a wish that he would get hurt.

Not at ALL!

Seriously!

It was only meant to say that I'd rather face an injured Wainwright than a healthy one.

A HEALTHY Wainwright is tough!

We've had enough of "tough" for a while, after Zimmerman and Strausberg!

Hope I've cleared up what I meant, seriously, because I SOOOO agree with you about that moron Puig, and Ramierz!

boly

[klaiggeb]

Boagie--Myself, I wish no ill on any of the Cardinals. They respect the game, they respect their opponents, and they should receive the same respect.

I hope both teams are healthy and play as an exciting series as we saw in 2012, with the same result, of course.

---boly says---

I think they are a reflection of Matheny; they play hard, don't go out to show anyone up, and DO respect the game!

I wish them no ill will, either..... BUT.... B U T:

I don't want a good series, I want a 4 game sweep by the Giants, and I'll take any advantage we can get!

I don't wish AW or any Cardinal ill at all.

But we're playing without Cain, without Pagan, and with 1/4 of Morse.

From what I read, they are all pretty healthy, or, at the very least, on the field.

We are hamstrung before we start.

Thus, I don't mind an injury or two, not career ending or threatening, for the Cardinals.

boly

[sfgdood]

lighten up boagie...we don't wish anything bad on Wainwright but I wont be sad if his already balky elbow wont let him be himself in this series. Fact is the Giants will be FAR from healthy. No Scutaro, no Cain, no Pagan and Morse probably not able to start. Why should we be the least bit sad about Wainwright? If he cant go or if he cant be his normal self, all I have to say is welcome to OUR world!

[islandboagie]

You really want to give the analysts and Rog another excuse to call the Giants winning, luck?

Trust me, I'm the last guy to care about an opposing player. When Ian Kennedy grazed Puig's nose with a fastball I was dissapointed. Dissapointed it wasn't a few inches more inside.

I won't lose any sleep for Wainwright if his arm is in fact dead. But I've kind of grown to respect the Cardinals due to them playing the same style of baseball the past number of years the Giants have. I enjoy good team play and chemistry because it makes the stat geeks eat crow. I enjoy watching this respectful rivalary blooming. I wouldn't wish a Cardinal to be unhealthy, because it gives these geeks who think they can determine who will win on a calculator another out if their numbers dont add up.

[rxmeister]

You know what the best compliments I've heard have been these last few days? Fans of neither team saying, "Giants vs. Cardinals again? I'm tired of seeing those two teams all the time!" Of course we know with our team it's more like every other year, but just the same it feels great to hear the disgust from opposition fans, because I know it's really respect. A few things from me:
1. Michael Morse is supposedly back and at 100 percent. He's actually in Arizona right now playing a couple of instructional league games to get his timing down. We didn't miss him when Pagan was in CF and Blanco moved to LF, but we miss him now, with Blanco and Ishi doing nothing offensively. I would consider starting him in game one, although with Bumgarner pitching we're probably better off thinking defense.
2. If Matt Cain is pitching game two for us, I wish full health for Adam Wainwright. No? Then I hope the elbow is balky. Nobody is wishing Tommy John surgery on him if we hope he's tired and not at his best.
3. All right handed starters for St. Louis. Big break for us, and another reason not to risk Morse.
4. Lots of people picking us to win this series. Finally some respect from the media.
5. Is it too much to ask Gregor Blanco to hit .250 in this series? We don't need 2003 Edgardo Alfonzo, just a few leadoff singles or walks!

[klaiggeb]

Well said, Mark.

You're pretty much on the same train as I am when it comes to Blanco.

It's NOT too much to ask of him to hit .250.

It isn't.

4th outfielder or not, he's a major league hitter, and he's OUR starter and OUR lead off guy. He HAS to do better than he has, and in game 4 vs Washington, he did.

We need more of the same.

boly

[islandboagie]

.250 would be nice, but not a crucial ingredient to us winning. He hit .250 in the last game, but it wasn't that hit that made the difference, it was the walk, and the good defense. If he can contribute in the same fashion I'll be happy. Blanco is not new to contributing in the post-season. If I remember correctly he hit a 2-run homerun in the Barry Zito game in St. Louis.

So, while hitting .250 would be good, contributing in any way that would help the Giants win, even if he doesn't hit .250, I'd be happy with.

[sfgdood]

1. stats geeks are going to say it was all luck if we beat the cards regardless of how injured the right elbow of Wainwright is

2. Blanco isn't the only one on the roster that underperformed in the lds. But it's a new series now. We'll see who steps up here

3. If Morse is on the roster I start him. This is what we signed him for. We're not paying him all that money to ride the pine.

4. A huge SF v. StL weekend concludes Monday Night with the Niners taking on the lambs...let's hope for a 3 game sweep!

[Rog]

Boly -- Brown? I don't think he'll be on the roster. I think it'll be Morse.

Rog -- If he's healthy, Morse is in. Brown's competition is Perez. Perez will almost certainly win out, although I personally would have no problem with its being Brown.

Read more: sfgiantsmessageboard.proboards.com/thread/2502/giants-game-1-concerned#ixzz3FlvmUaO6

[Rog]

While it's hard to get too upset when an adversary's player or players aren't healthy, I would rather beat them at full strength. Of course, the Giants themselves aren't nearly at full strength. But I'd still rather play a team at its best -- and beat them, of course.

[Rog]

Boagie -- You really want to give the analysts and Rog another excuse to call the Giants winning, luck?

Rog -- I don't know of anyone who believes that winning is ALL luck. I also don't know many who believe that luck doesn't enter into it at all.

I am becoming more and more amazed by what seems to be the Giants' magic. But then I think back to the series in which it all began and realize the Giants probably wouldn't have won the series if not for Brooks Conrad.

There are two things I believe we all know for sure:

. It isn't all luck.

. Luck is involved.

Read more: sfgiantsmessageboard.proboards.com/thread/2502/giants-game-1-concerned?page=1#ixzz3FlxuoLqD

[Rog]

Randy -- stats geeks are going to say it was all luck if we beat the cards regardless of how injured the right elbow of Wainwright is

Rog -- Here is my recommendation, Randy. It's my recommendation not just for you, but for anyone. Show where someone said that ANY Giants series win was ALL luck, or just start building credibility by not saying it.

Some say that as, put up or shut up.

Read more: sfgiantsmessageboard.proboards.com/thread/2502/giants-game-1-concerned?page=1#ixzz3FlyoMXFG

[Rog]

Randy -- Niners taking on the lambs.

Rog -- Why the need to use demeaning terms for opponents? Even Boly right now will likely tell you the 49ers are probably better than the Rams right now, although he's hoping that's not the case. If you truly believe your team is better, is it necessary to demean the other team? And if the other team is better, does demeaning them change that fact?

[klaiggeb]

That I will.

The Rams, my team stink, have stunk, and will continue to stink for a long time to come.

But in answer to your question, Rog... THAT'S what the guys on top do; they demean the other team.

In Game 3 of the playoffs. I saw some morons carrying brooms to the game.

That's just trying to rub it into the face of the other team.

THEY call it, just having fun.

But it's not.


I was at a charity function during the Giant fall over the summer. I was wearing my Giant hat because it was HOT, and it was the only nice looking hat I had.
]
Guy behind one table starts squeeking at me: "Sweep, Sweep! Sweep!"

I just started at him, trying to keep my cool... then I lost it.

Tight jawed, and with fists ready to fly, I hissed back at him: "You're about 7 seconds away from getting that bottle of wine shoved up your ass!"

My wife, standing next to me was stunned! She walked away not knowing what to say, or worse, what I was going to do.

The guy says, "Man! I was just having a little fun."

I wanted to say, "Fun my ass! Fun for who?"

But I didn't.

Instead, I apologized and said, "I don't consider that fun."

And it wasn't and isn't.

THAT kind of stuff is what STARTS fights. It's NOT fun. Not fun at all.


I almost went after him over the table, that's how close it was.

I'm 64. I should know better. There is NO excuse for letting a jackass get under my skin. None at all.

But he touched a nerve. A sensitive never.


What happened to being a "humble" winner?

what happened to good sportsman ship?

Gone.

Gone with the rising of the millennium children.

Gone with anyone and everyone typing whatever they want while hiding behind a key board.


Years ago, when there was NO keyboard to hide behind, no one would say that kind of stuff to your face because someone would have bashed it in.

Now, the millennium children do so without fear, and worse, without REGARD for whom they are offending.

And that last part is what disturbs me the most; without regard to whom they are offending.




boly

[sfgdood]

Sorry but you guys just don't get it. I've been using derogatory nicknames for other teams that face my teams since I was a kid. It wasn't to "demean" anyone or rub it in anyone's nose. I did it when my teams were on the bottom looking up. Brooms are brought to EVERY ballpark when the home team has a chance to sweep. It's a tradition. You guys need to lighten up. This isn't the UN...it's sports fanaticism. Quit trippin and learn to have some fun.

[Rog]

The one demeaning nickname I can think that I wouldn't feel bad about using is "Bums" for the Dodgers, since it was pretty much a traditional term even before I was born. I rarely use it, but I might have used it once or twice here.

Back in the old days it was the Bums and the Gints. Not Giants. Gints.

As for using demeaning nicknames for opponents since one was a kid, it probably wasn't the greatest move as a kid, and certainly one a person could outgrow as he became an adult.

I realize this isn't the biggest issue in the world, but I am a big believer in treating people with respect. I slip on occasion, but I do try. Others here also try -- my patience!

[Rog]

I'm not a believer in yelling at players from the stands either, but there was one time I was sitting somewhere behind the visitors' dugout and a fan was all over Billy Buckner. (This was before Buckner had his unfortunate World Series miscue.) The guy was extremely funny, and I think even Billy Buck got a kick out of it.

If someone is clever, it becomes good natured (somewhat at least). But if one can't be clever, he's probably better off letting it go.

[rxmeister]

I'm surprised to hear you got so upset, Boly. I would have smiled and told him congratulations, because I were pretty sure we were done at that point. Maybe that's why I don't have to take any medication at my advanced age! I certainly would have looked for him after game five though!

[rxmeister]

Boagie, I think you should re read my comments because I mentioned that the .250 should be accompanied by walks, and you mentioned the walk as key and made it sound like it was something I overlooked. He did exactly what I asked him to do in game four, and played a key role in the win.

[klaiggeb]

Mark--I'm surprised to hear you got so upset, Boly. I would have smiled and told him congratulations, because I were pretty sure we were done at that point. Maybe that's why I don't have to take any medication at my advanced age! I certainly would have looked for him after game five though!

---boly says---

Trust me Mark, I WAS SURPRISED at my reaction.

I was standing there thinking about how to say something funny... and then THAT came out.

It's part of the "old" me; the "volatile" me; the part of my past I like/try my best to keep burried and under control.

We all have demons of one kind or another, and mine is a very, very bad temper.

I grew up in a school and an area where people only talked and argued for a momemt... then they started to hit.


Would I have handled it differently, in retrospect? Heck yes!



But it drives me CRAZY when people on top have to lord it over those on the other end, either by bringing brooms to games, saying stupid stuff like "sweep, sweep!" or throwing out the good old, "I told you so!"


Like I said; what happened to being humble? To being a good sport?

Why is there such a need in some people to rub their success in the face of others?


I don't fit in this world. I get that. I'm a throw back to another time and era.


For all my flaws, and there are many, I WON'T trade being humble and being concerned about the feelings of others for all the gold in the world.

boly

[klaiggeb]

Randy--Sorry but you guys just don't get it. I've been using derogatory nicknames for other teams that face my teams since I was a kid. It wasn't to "demean" anyone or rub it in anyone's nose. I did it when my teams were on the bottom looking up. Brooms are brought to EVERY ballpark when the home team has a chance to sweep. It's a tradition. You guys need to lighten up. This isn't the UN...it's sports fanaticism. Quit trippin and learn to have some fun.

---boly says---

First of all, I appreciate your not taking my "millenium children" comments to mean I was talking about you, Randy. I wasn't.

I lost sleep worrying about that. I really did and couldn't wait to get back on line and apologize if you did. That wasn't my intent.


You call it "sports fanaticsm," and seem to think, as most under the age of 50 do, that excuses the behavior.

I disagree, and I disagree vehemently.

It's not acceptable to rub someone's face in their teams failures.

Fun? Maybe for the guy saying it, but not for the other guy.

That's not fun, that's cruel.

I'll take it one step further: THAT'S sadistic.



Why the need to make them feel more badly than they already do?


YOUR team is better.

YOUR team won.

The guy on the other side knows that.

Why the need to make him feel worse by rubbing salt in the wound?


I have a LOT of complaints with the under 35 generation, and this one is near the top of the list.

No concern for the feelings of others, just the need to make "ME" feel better.



Sorry, Randy. It's not fun, and it's not right.

I may BE an old fart, I may BE from another time zone, but that kind of memememe behavior is just wrong, and has no place in sports, or in the world.

And yeah, that's my humble opinion.


boly

[islandboagie]

I understood your point, Mark. I just don't believe Blanco has to hit .250 to be a contributer. As an example, if Blanco has only one hit in the series, but that one hit is a bases clearing triple to win one of the games, I don't believe he will not have been a key player in the series.

[Rog]

Boly -- Boagie, I think you should re read my comments because I mentioned that the .250 should be accompanied by walks, and you mentioned the walk as key and made it sound like it was something I overlooked.

Rog -- Over the course of the season, being a .250 hitter who walked was a pretty accurate description of Gregor Blanco, although he actually hit .260.

Read more: sfgiantsmessageboard.proboards.com/thread/2502/giants-game-1-concerned#ixzz3Fr0gQ07e

[Rog]

If we want to look at the Giants' leadoff man who DIDN'T take walks, that would be Angel Pagan. Angel's OBP was only nine points higher than Blanco's -- even though Pagan hit 40 points higher. If we're truly looking for a leadoff man who works the count and takes walks, we should be looking at Blanco, not Pagan.

Could we be criticizing the wrong guy here -- or at least for the wrong reason?

One good point Boly made is that Gregor IS indeed hitting far fewer ground balls than prior to this season. Hit right at his career average though. In fact, Gregor's .257 overall average with the Giants is the same as the .257 he's hit over his career. His .691 OPS as a Giants is very close to his .688 career mark.

Gregor's OPS+ as a Giants has been 99, which implies he's been close to an average hitter. That's pretty good for a 4th outfielder who can play a very good center field.

[sfgdood]

Boly you're not reading my words. I make reference to other teams in these funny nicknames when I talk among my friends. If they cant take a joke about our sports teams then we probably wont be hanging out much. We make fun of each other and our teams all the time and nobody has conquered the fear of laughing at himself and his team more than I. You need to learn not to take such nicknames (about your teams) so personally or seriously. Sports were meant for having fun. Fun is hard when you're wound as tight as a drum.

[rxmeister]

I agree with Dood on this. It's just good natured fun to make fun of teams and players named. There's nothing personal, and just an attempt at humor. I was calling the Cardinals pitcher Adam Wainwrong when he was struggling last night, and their first baseman Fatt Adams. Just having fun and relieving tension.