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Post by allenreed on Sept 10, 2013 12:31:29 GMT -5
With their 1-0 win over Texas last night the Pirates guaranteed their first winning season since 1992. And we complain about the Giants.
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Post by sharksrog on Sept 11, 2013 1:41:42 GMT -5
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Post by allenreed on Sept 11, 2013 13:29:02 GMT -5
Oh, you mean the perjuror, tax cheat, philanderer, woman beater, steroid cheat? How did I know you were going to bring this up?
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Post by rxmeister on Sept 11, 2013 22:37:19 GMT -5
Tell us how you really feel about him, Allen. By the way, the woman beater charge is not accurate. His wife claimed that during the divorce proceedings to get more money, saying he beat her so badly she was physically unable to work, but the judge threw all the abuse charges out, and Bonds had an army of witnesses to testify that she had never so much as a bruise. I think you owe Barry an apology! And philanderer? Him and 95 % of all pro athletes! Steroid user? Ask Jose Canseco how many ball players did that. Tax evasion? I think you have mixed him up with Al Capone! You know who did commit tax evasion though? Willie McCovey. You like him, don't you? You probably have him with the perjury charge though. Forgive me if I don't hate him though.
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Post by allenreed on Sept 12, 2013 0:09:19 GMT -5
Not just the first wife, but the mistress said she was physically attacked by Bonds in a roid rage.
Just because other people do something doesn't make it right.
Actually Bonds didn't report income he earned autographing memorabilia. Tax cheat. Along with Timothy Geithner.
I guess I like McCovey. He's not my favorite though.
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Post by rxmeister on Sept 12, 2013 9:20:55 GMT -5
Orlando Cepeda went to prison for drug possession as well. Heroes sometimes have feet of clay. Barry Bonds mistress tried to make a living off of her affair with Barry, so again, you hardly have an impeccable source here. I don't think Barry was ever convicted of tax evasion, so if he's guilty of that, it's only in the court of Allen.
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Post by allenreed on Sept 12, 2013 13:40:44 GMT -5
I think Orlando actually went once for drug smuggling. Barry benefited mightily from celebrity justice. He should be in prison.
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Post by rxmeister on Sept 12, 2013 14:25:31 GMT -5
Allen, prisons are overcrowded as they are. Do you really think someone should go to prison and be on the tax payer's dime because he lied under oath about using steroids. Would you feel safer walking the streets at night if Barry was in prison?
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Post by allenreed on Sept 12, 2013 16:42:43 GMT -5
A crime is a crime. He comitted perjury, and he should pay the price. He should be sharing a cell with Eric Holder. You think if you commited perjury, you would get off, even if the matter was not a matter of public safety?
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Post by sharksrog on Sept 13, 2013 9:41:37 GMT -5
Allen -- A crime is a crime. He comitted perjury, and he should pay the price. Rog -- Not wanting to get into a political or philosophican discussion here, but sad, isn't it, that there are so many crimes committed today that the prisons don't have room for all the criminals (even though petty crimes are often ignored), and that far too much prison emphasis is put on punishment and not enough on rehabilitation? That said, I worked for two years at a halfway house for ex-convicts, and I'm not sure anywhere near all criminals can be rehabilitated. And that's sad, too. Read more: sfgiantsmessageboard.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=general&thread=2001&page=1#14872#ixzz2emea7GJD |
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Post by allenreed on Sept 13, 2013 13:15:58 GMT -5
The solution is simple. Build more prisons, and use the death penalty when it is warranted. Lots of room in the SoCal desert for more prisons. Don't let these guys sit on death row for years and years. If they're sentenced to death, do it the next day.
In alot of cases, the purpose shouldn't be rehabilitation or punishment. It's getting these people put away because they pose such a threat to the safety of others.
California has long been more concerned with the rights of criminals than the rights and safety of their victims. Now they're going to pass out drivers licenses to illegals, (read:criminals). Wonder if there will be any fraud there.
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Post by Islandboagie on Sept 13, 2013 15:42:59 GMT -5
Maybe we should build a prison just to hold Barry Bonds and Tim Lincecum? Then, after they become too expensive to feed we can melt down both of Tim's WS rings (since he never deserved them) into 2 bullets, 1 for each of them.
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Post by allenreed on Sept 13, 2013 16:54:21 GMT -5
What did Lincecum do to deserve prison? Not knowing your job is not a crime.
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Post by Islandboagie on Sept 13, 2013 17:42:15 GMT -5
You know I was being sarcastic. How does Tim not know his job? A players job is to help his team be the best, which Tim managed to do more times than Mays, McCovey and Marichal put together.
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Post by allenreed on Sept 13, 2013 19:10:03 GMT -5
Part of Tim's job is to cover and backup bases at the appropriate times. Doesn't do it, doesn't seem to want to learn it.
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Post by rxmeister on Sept 14, 2013 7:23:52 GMT -5
Well, Timmy was once caught speeding with marijuana in his possession, so I guess some would want him in prison for that, although I'm certainly not one of them. I'm sure Allen is happy that Barry's conviction was upheld yesterday and he can now start his long grueling sentence of thirty days home confinement in his mansion!
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Post by klaiggeb on Sept 14, 2013 10:28:56 GMT -5
A players job is to help his team be the best, which Tim managed to do more times than Mays, McCovey and Marichal put together.
---boly says----
Umm... NO!
I sure hope you're being sarcastic, or faceateaous here, Boagie, because what you wrote is not just goofy a little, it's goofy all the way out to Neptune.
boly
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Post by sharksrog on Sept 15, 2013 12:22:14 GMT -5
Let's get it clear. There is a difference between being the best team and winning the World Series.
Either one is great, and they certainly are far from mutually exclusive, but begin the former doesn't guarantee the latter, and being the latter doesn't prove the former.
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Post by Islandboagie on Sept 15, 2013 16:52:56 GMT -5
What does prove that a team is the best? Stats? Analysts picking that team to win? How does any of this trump actually proving it on the field?
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Post by sharksrog on Sept 15, 2013 17:38:55 GMT -5
Boagie -- What does prove that a team is the best? Rog -- Nothing PROVES that a team is the best. But since winning is the name of the game, I would say that the team that wins the highest percentage of its games is right up there. Boagie -- Stats? Rog -- Just one. Won-loss record. Actually, even that's likely not true, since even over a full season, luck doesn't always equal out. Also, level of competition likely enters into it. Boagie -- Analysts picking that team to win? Rog -- Of course not. Boagie -- How does any of this trump actually proving it on the field? Rog -- Proving it on the field of play is the best way. And since 162 games is a far more significant sample than 19, the team that wins the World Series isn't always the best. Using 2010 as an example, if the Giants were truly the best team in the game in 2010, why did it take them until the last day of the season to even guarantee they would make the playoffs? The best team in the game should have easily been able to put away the competition over such a large sample as 162 games. Read more: sfgiantsmessageboard.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=general&thread=2001&page=1#14985#ixzz2f0HA8zu0 |
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Post by Islandboagie on Sept 15, 2013 19:39:42 GMT -5
So you think a team that has the best record in a weak division should be considered the best team just because they were able to beat up on weak teams all season? I think the best way to prove you're the best team is to play and beat the other best teams.
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Post by sharksrog on Sept 16, 2013 14:24:13 GMT -5
Boagie -- So you think a team that has the best record in a weak division should be considered the best team just because they were able to beat up on weak teams all season? Rog -- No. I think somewhere in here I did mention quality of competition. If not, I was remiss. Boagie -- I think the best way to prove you're the best team is to play and beat the other best teams. Rog -- I both agree and disagree with that. Generally speaking, I agree. On the other hand, if you're truly the best team, you should be able to beat up on the poorer teams as well. In 2010, the Giants made the playoffs because they went a combined 43-17 against the Diamondbacks, Cubs, Marlins, Brewers, Pirates and Nationals. They went only 49-53 if we take out the weak sisters named above. They were only 6-12 against the Padres, the team they beat out for the NL West championship on the last day of the season. If we include their successful postseason, they were essentially .500 against all the teams in baseball not including the Diamondbacks, Cubs, Marlins, Brewers, Pirates and Nationals. So were the Giants truly the best team in 2010? One could make an argument that the best team in the NL was the Phillies, although they too beat up on the weak sisters. As a general rule, I think most teams make the postseason by beating up on the weak teams. Against the good ones, they're usually around .500. Which further means that the good team that gets hot at the right time will likely win the World Series -- not necessarily the best team. Read more: sfgiantsmessageboard.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=general&thread=2001&page=1#15010#ixzz2f5FJHR4v |
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Post by sharksrog on Sept 17, 2013 9:29:20 GMT -5
As I think about it -- won-loss, won-loss against top teams, strength of competition, and run differential would each be determining factors.
To me, the best team is generally the team that would be favored to win the World Series based on what happened in the regular season. If two or more teams were really close, the postseason could be the decider.
Here is what I want to believe for the World Champions to truly be the best team: If were somehow able to rewind 100 times to the beginning of the playoffs or season, which team would win the most championships out of those 100 times?
Obviously, this is impossible, but I think to some extent it is predictable. If the 2010 and 2012 postseasons could be rewound back to the beginning, how many times would the Giants win? There is no way of knowing, of course, but even knowing how the first (and only real) playoffs turned out, I don't think I would choose the Giants as the most likely.
Here's another concept involved: Is the best team the one that would most often win a one-game shootout ,or a 5-game series. or a 7-game series, or a 162-game season? It is conceivable the four answers would be different.
No question the playoffs are the easy way of determining the best team. But oft times it likely doesn't yield the team that is truly the best.
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