donk
New Member
Posts: 23
|
Post by donk on Feb 13, 2013 14:29:54 GMT -5
The deciding game of the Caribbean Series went 18 innings and the winning run was a home run by one time Giant, Doug Clark playing for Mexico...
Bengie Molina signed as Cards assistant batting coach..
Saw my first game...typical early season game...wild pitching...and I almost froze my rear...saw only one scout at the game...part timer, Tommy Butler of White Sox....didn't sit with him so I don't know who he was watching....Tommy is aging and has trouble walking but keeps refusing to let me help him up the stairs...The Sox shook up their scouting staff and I didn't have nerve to ask him how he and his son made out....
Interesting to see that Tim and Posey have no personal problem, but they have to get on the same page....just as I have been saying...pitchers like Tim, Zito and Vogey, all highly wound guys give the body language that they don't like the way Posey calls a game...and he seems to be stubborn about changing his sign,...I never saw anyone comment on Vogey shaking Tim off 4 times on the very first pitch of a game....Cain and MadBum seem to go with the flow....but I get a little nervous about MadBum continues to throw his fastball and sliders inside to RH batters, pitch after pitch....I would also like to see Posey set up his target closer to the outside pitch when he tries to get a batter to chase....Giant pitchers seem to not get the call on too many pitches that hit the outside target..just off the plate....
|
|
|
|
Post by sharksrog on Feb 14, 2013 10:28:50 GMT -5
|
|
donk
New Member
Posts: 23
|
Post by donk on Feb 14, 2013 14:40:05 GMT -5
seems like you missed Tim's comments on trying to get on the right page with Posey as far as calling pitches...and since you never agree or disagree, I repeat these things when they come up in the news.....and how many times do you bring up Koufax and Dodgers' Stadium...and Crawford and K/BB...and sometimes you add in /HR....
|
|
|
|
Post by allenreed on Feb 14, 2013 16:42:06 GMT -5
At times, I'm sure Posey hasn't been thrilled with the way they've pitched the game. Especially when Timmy's bouncing pitches five feet in front of the plate on a regular basis.
|
|
|
|
Post by Islandboagie on Feb 14, 2013 18:42:42 GMT -5
dk- seems like you missed Tim's comments on trying to get on the right page with Posey as far as calling pitches
Boagie- Tim never said that, here's his quote:
“Yeah, that’s something that I’m going to be working on this year,” Lincecum said of working with Posey. “Obviously we didn’t throw to each other many times last year, but when we did – in the playoffs – it worked out. There’s nothing going on. It’s just a matter who was coaching that day and who (manager Bruce) Bochy would put in there.”
Posey called the matter “just speculation. Timmy and I have a great relationship. And ultimately, he and I want the same thing, and that’s to win.”
Bochy from last season -
“That is completely false – completely false,” Bochy told reporters. “Timmy doesn’t care who he throws to, and it’s my call when I want to get Buster a break.”
It shouldn't be surprising -- at all -- that Bochy is giving Posey breaks.
“(Posey) wasn’t going to catch all three, I wanted to give him a breather, and to be honest, Timmy can be hard on a catcher,” Bochy said. “He can beat you up pretty good, and I didn’t want Buster to be in another tough game after catching on hot weather (Thursday).
“And that’s the truth. It’s totally my decision here.”
Can you get that through your skull, Don?
It's a topic that the bay area media is beating to death, they did it with Zito and Molina, they did it with Zito and Posey, now they're doing it with Lincecum and Posey. There's absolutely no evidence beyond a normal catching schedule for the backup catcher to keep him sharp and give Posey rest. I don't know why fans are still fixated on this like it's some steamy gossip at a tupperware party. It's ridiculous.
|
|
donk
New Member
Posts: 23
|
Post by donk on Feb 15, 2013 2:30:33 GMT -5
all I did was repeat what Tim said and what a reporter added...but I didn't paste it...my skull is really not that thick...
|
|
|
|
Post by rxmeister on Feb 15, 2013 15:26:52 GMT -5
If Lincecum doesn't want to throw to Posey, I have a simple solution. Instead of moving Posey to first when Timmy's pitching, perhaps Bochy should rest him. Let Timmy try to win without their best hitter in the lineup. After a couple of 2-1 and 1-0 losses, he might sing a different tune. Timmy's in his walk year, coming off a bad year. His opinion should mean squat to Bochy.
|
|
|
|
Post by sharksrog on Feb 15, 2013 16:39:48 GMT -5
Don -- all I did was repeat what Tim said and what a reporter added...but I didn't paste it...my skull is really not that thick... Rog -- You can almost certainly get that on-line, Don. Boagie did a great job of quoting at least three sources on the subject, which is ... well, three more than you did. Perhaps you can come up with a quote or two, but Boagie has a broad context for his opinion. What to know what I think? I think Tim's approach is more of a feel thing, while Buster's approach is more scientific. I think when Tim had such severe problems last summer, he felt he needed to change some things. I'm just speculating here, of course, but the speculation does fit with what we know. Read more: sfgiantsmessageboard.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=general&thread=1556&page=1#8888#ixzz2L0RHtgQj |
|
|
|
Post by sharksrog on Feb 15, 2013 16:48:06 GMT -5
Mark -- If Lincecum doesn't want to throw to Posey, I have a simple solution. Instead of moving Posey to first when Timmy's pitching, perhaps Bochy should rest him. Let Timmy try to win without their best hitter in the lineup. After a couple of 2-1 and 1-0 losses, he might sing a different tune. Timmy's in his walk year, coming off a bad year. His opinion should mean squat to Bochy. Rog -- In terms of games caught by Buster, I think it might be feasible for Tim to have Hector Sanchez catch all (or at least the vast majority) of his starts. If Tim gets 32 starts, that would leave 130 games for Buster behind the plate. I doubt the Giants want him catching too much more than that. That said, it would seem better to me to rest Buster primarily against right-handers, since he just crushes southpaws, and Brandon Belt and Gregor Blanco hit righties better than southpaws. Buster played the last 27 regular season games, and each of the 16 post-season games. That's 32 straight games, although at this moment I don't know how many of them he caught. I would think the Giants would like to have Buster catch 130-140 games, and play in something like 150-155 overall. Read more: sfgiantsmessageboard.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=general&thread=1556&page=1#ixzz2L0SMVzHT |
|
donk
New Member
Posts: 23
|
Post by donk on Feb 15, 2013 17:20:31 GMT -5
Don -- all I did was repeat what Tim said and what a reporter added...but I didn't paste it...my skull is really not that thick... ... well, three more than you did.Those are the stated reasons why Hector Sanchez became Lincecum’s regular catcher last season. Unspoken, but also a factor, is that Lincecum connects best with a catcher who can pump him up on the mound and build his confidence, much like Bengie Molina used to do. Posey’s motivational speeches are more likely to be tough love than rah-rah rhetoric. And while Posey studies scouting reports and believes in attacking a hitter’s weaknesses, Lincecum is more like a jazz improvisationalist – going with the pitches that are working on a given day and that he has the most confidence to throw. dk..this is the best I can do... So yes, Posey and Lincecum do have some work to do as a battery. And given the relative stature and importance of both players, this isn't a topic that will die down anytime soon. But from everything I’ve gathered over the past two years, there’s no actual malice or dislike between the two. Perhaps you can come up with a quote or two, but Boagie has a broad context for his opinion. What to know what I think? I think Tim's approach is more of a feel thing, while Buster's approach is more scientific. I think when Tim had such severe problems last summer, he felt he needed to change some things. I'm just speculating here, of course, but the speculation does fit with what we know. Read more: sfgiantsmessageboard.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=general&thread=1556&page=1#8888#ixzz2L0RHtgQj |
|
sfgdood
Long time member 
stats geeks never played the game...that's why they don't get it and never will
Posts: 90
|
Post by sfgdood on Feb 15, 2013 18:45:19 GMT -5
Donk - seems like you missed Tim's comments on trying to get on the right page with Posey as far as calling pitches...and since you never agree or disagree, I repeat these things when they come up in the news.....
Dood - I admit I wasn't paying close attention to the shaking and not shaking of signs in the playoffs. Seems to me the pitchers liked Posey well enough to pitch very well in October, including Vogey, Zito AND Tim. If they did shake him off a lot, it didn't seem to bother their rythmn. You might want to get off this train, old timer...it's going nowhere except towards more parades down Market Street.
~Dood
|
|
|
|
Post by sharksrog on Feb 16, 2013 0:52:36 GMT -5
Johnny Bench is very high on Buster, and there are indeed similarities between the two. One of them is that each finished very near the top of his high school class. Buster had a 4.0 average one semester in college.
Before calling each pitch, Buster usually looks at the batter in the box to see if he can pick anything up. He's a pretty sharp dude, so I suspect he's calling pretty good pitches.
One thing I did read is that it was Romo who chose to throw the final fastball to Miguel Cabrera to close out the World Series. Gutsy call on his part.
A couple of things pointed out recently on Clubhouse Confidential.
Since AT&T was an extreme pitchers' park this past season, Buster's OPS+ led the majors. His 172 was higher than any catcher aside from Mike Piazza. And Buster did have much better numbers on the road, especially power-wise.
And regarding Romo, he relied far more heavily on his slider last season than in previous seasons. And his fastball was down as much as Tim's in velocity.
Sergio has a DYNAMITE slider, but throwing it more can lead to more hitters guessing right, and also to potential elbow problems for Sergio. In 2011, Sergio's fastbal was a nice weapon. Despite that last pitch of the World Series, this past season, not so much.
One positive is that Sergio is said to be improving his change up, which should aid him in what is already some nice pitching against southpaws.
It is said that not every reliever can close, but last season Santiago Casilla was dynamic until a blister slowed him down, and Romo was terrific in picking up the late-season slack.
Of course, they also said the bullpen-by-committee couldn't work.
|
|
|
|
Post by Islandboagie on Feb 16, 2013 9:48:33 GMT -5
Rog- That said, it would seem better to me to rest Buster primarily against right-handers, since he just crushes southpaws, and Brandon Belt and Gregor Blanco hit righties better than southpaws.
Boagie- I agree with you on Buster and Belt, but Blanco actually hit lefties a tad better than righties last year. Now, that may have alot to do with the fact he probably got most of his at-bats against lefties when he was hot. I don't think Blanco's playing time should be determined by righty-lefty matchups, and maybe more about who he has success against and who Torres doesn't have success against, and of course, who's hot and who isn't.
|
|
|
|
Post by sharksrog on Feb 16, 2013 10:29:32 GMT -5
Boagie- I agree with you on Buster and Belt, but Blanco actually hit lefties a tad better than righties last year. Now, that may have alot to do with the fact he probably got most of his at-bats against lefties when he was hot. I don't think Blanco's playing time should be determined by righty-lefty matchups, and maybe more about who he has success against and who Torres doesn't have success against, and of course, who's hot and who isn't. Rog -- There are a lot of moving parts involved between catcher, first base and left field. Buster can catch and play first base. He is the Giants' best defensive catcher and not bad at first. Belt can play first base or left field. He's an excellent defensive first baseman and is serviceable in left. Blanco and Torres are two of the best defensive left fielders in the game, and can play center or right, as well. Pagan and Pence are close to fixtures in center and right, meaning the opportunities of Blanco and Torres at other outfield positions is limited -- barrring injury or slumps from Pagan and/or Pence. Hector Sanchez is a switch hitter behind the plate whom Lincecum and Zito -- two-fifths of the rotation -- have shown a preference for pitching to. Here are a few potential dynamics of the situation: . Let's start with Posey, which is indeed where the shifing begins. The Giants will likely want Buster to catch 130-140 games if healthy. And while they would like to rest him on occasion, they would probably like him to play 145-150 games overall. Posey caught both Zito and Lincecum quite well in the postseason, and the Giants are strongest defensively with him behind the plate. . Sanchez's play behind the plate will be quite limited, barring injury. Even though Sanchez is a switch hitter and a young player who likely would benefit from playing every day. . Belt's bat is likely to be potent enough this season that he will seldom be on the bench so that Buster can play first base, as was the case on many occasions last year. . Like Blanco, Belt can hit lefties pretty decently for a left-handed batter, but his defense suffers badly in the outfield compared to his excellent work at first base. . Torres hit extremely well against southpaws in 2012. The bottom line is that Posey should rest or play first base against right-handers. He crushes southpaws. If plays first base, that takes the lefty hitters Belt or Blanco out of the lineup against righties, or takes either Belt or Torres out of the lineup against southpaws. When Buster rests against right-handers, Belt and Blanco retain their regular spots. It gets more difficult when Buster plays first base against right-handers. The Giants lose defense if they play Belt in the outfield, and they lose offense if they play Blanco instead. Look for Buster to DH a lot when possible. That helps both the offense and the defense. I think the bottom line on this is that both Buster and Belt will be close to constants in the equation. Sanchez will play as little as feasible, since that hurts the defense and usually the offense as well. This probably means more pure days off for Buster and less time at first base. It means he will likely play as much or more than last season, even with fewer games at first. It seems likely the Giants will benefit from playing the combination of Buster, Belt and Blanco/Torres as often as possible. This is likely the season Belt establishes himself. It is likely a season in which Sanchez will struggle for playing time. . Read more: sfgiantsmessageboard.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=general&thread=1556&page=1#8938#ixzz2L4gfO9P1 |
|
|
|
Post by Islandboagie on Feb 16, 2013 11:40:57 GMT -5
I agree with everything you said here, Rog. I was just commenting on your previous statement that Blanco hits righties better than lefties. Last season that wasn't the case. That bodes well for Blanco because if he plays like he did during the first part of last year then he could become the starting left fielder and Torres could be purely a backup. That would also be the best scenario for the Giants and Bruce Bochy, because he wouldn't feel the need to move everyone around and downgrade the defense when Posey doesn't catch.
|
|
|
|
Post by sharksrog on Feb 16, 2013 22:34:44 GMT -5
Boagie -- I agree with everything you said here, Rog. I was just commenting on your previous statement that Blanco hits righties better than lefties. Last season that wasn't the case. That bodes well for Blanco because if he plays like he did during the first part of last year then he could become the starting left fielder and Torres could be purely a backup. That would also be the best scenario for the Giants and Bruce Bochy, because he wouldn't feel the need to move everyone around and downgrade the defense when Posey doesn't catch. Rog -- I wasn't disagreeing with your statement, Boagie. In fact, I found it intriguing. My guess is that going forward, Gregor will hit righties better, as he has over his full career. Last season he was about even against righties and southpaws -- except that he clearly had more power against lefties. I'm not so sure that will continue. But this isn't necessarily a bad thing. Andres Torres has clearly hit better against southpaws than righties, which would usually be expected, since he is right-handed. If Gregor hits for better numbers because he fares well against southpaws, that is good. But if his overall numbers remain the same, the better he is against righties, the better he will complement Andres. Brandon Belt does just find against southpaws, hitting them better over his career than righties. Last season he was about equal against each handed pitcher, hitting for better average and getting on base more against righties, but hitting for more power against lefties. Over his career, Brandon's average is slightly higher against southpaws, and his SLG is 75 points higher. So there doesn't seem much need to platoon Brandon, even though he might occasionally sit out against southpaws if Buster plays first base. Or he just might move to left field, with both Gregor and Andres available as highly capable pinch runners and defensive replacements. The guy who really doesn't seem to fit well through this is Hector Sanchez. Since Buster shouldn't catch every day, Hector will get some games in, but that seems more a necessity than an advantage. Posey is the Giants' nonpareil. Belt should become one of their better hitters and is clearly their best defensive first baseman. Blanco should be their best all-around left fielder. Torres has the advantage against southpaws and potentially could be as good or better than Blanco all-around. The Giants have options. Left field isn't ideal, but with the possibility of Blanco, Torres and Belt each getting some time there, it's far from a disaster. I think the Giants will win the West, perhaps fairly handily, so I would send Hector back to Fresno for a while. Perhaps Buster won't need too much rest early on. The Giants have 10 days off through June 10th. I realize the Giants don't have much else besides Hector, but I think he would benefit from getting more work. Will the Giants be willing to send Hector out for more work? Not unless he struggles early. I just feel that Hector needs time to work on his hitting (,295 OBP) and catching (3 passed balls and 24 wild pitches in 441 innings, plus a below-average 23% caught stealing). There will be some serviceable catcher available to the Giants once spring training cuts are made by all the teams. Last season Hector hit southpaws better than righties (again, not unusual, since he is a right-handed player even though he switch hits). If the Giants would benefit from resting Buster against righties, Hector's hitting shrivels even further. Last season his SLG hitting lefty was 63 points lower than against southpaws, and he drove in only four more runs despite 60 more at bats. I don't mean to dog Hector, who is very young and could still develop, but he really wasn't nearly as good last season as most think -- especially against right-handers. Defensively part of Hector's below-average caught stealings and his well above-average number of wild pitches can be blamed on catching Tim Lincecum -- but certainly not all of his deficiencies in those two areas. Almost shockingly, Hector has only one fewer career passed ball than Buster, even though Buster has four times as many innings behind the plate. Come to think of it, I believe Hector may be the most overrated Giant. But he is just 23 years of age. I think he needs more time in the minors to develop. He has had only 168 minor league at bats above Class A ball. Read more: sfgiantsmessageboard.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=general&thread=1556&page=1#8940#ixzz2L7bCAumt |
|
