Hwang

[klaiggeb]

Problem with your logic, Don is that I have YET to hear a pitcher, either current of former Giant berate Buster's ability to call and manage a game.


They rave about him.

boly

[Islandboagie]

The most important things I rate a catcher is how he relates with his pitchers and how he runs the defensive part of the game.....all I see with Posey is a guy who shows very little in "thinking" along with his pitchers.

Boagie- Obviously you don't remember Posey working over the best hitter in baseball to end the 2012 World Series. The guy watched a fastball right down the middle.

[Islandboagie]

Back to the original topic of this thread, it would be surprising to me if Hwang didn't make the team, especially now with Nunez's sore shoulder. A Hwang/Gillaspie platoon would be interesting to see.

[klaiggeb]

I agree, Boagie, I was thinking the EXACT same thing.

I've been impressed by Hwang in a number of areas, not the least of which is his flat, quick, level swing.

The guy PUTS the bat on the ball.

He's also quicker than I thought.

Can he platoon in LF with Parker when Nunez comes back?

Or is LF destined to become a platoon with Parker and Marrero, who has impressed THE crap outta me.

Rarely strikes out, and can flat out drive a baseball over any fence, LF, RF, or CF.

boly

[Islandboagie]

If Hwang performs in April I would guess Nunez loses his starting job at 3rd base. Nunez has a lot to offer as a bench player. He can play multiple positions, he can be used as a pinch hitter or a pinch runner.

Having Gillaspie AND Hwang on the bench really disturbs the versatility of the bench. That's why I was always touting Gillaspie as the starter. I tend to look at what's better for the team as a whole.

[klaiggeb]

Gillaspie's track record of a starter is not promising, Boagie. That's why I want him getting around 250 at bats, and that's it.

as to Nunez, I don't see him losing his job because of his speed and his gap power.

He really hasn't done that well in the "super utility" role UNLESS he's playing 5 -6 days/week.

I think we NEED that speed every day, or most every day.

But the fact that he's STILL having pain when he throws... that's disturbing.

Sounds too much like a rotor cuff injury, or something almost as bad that will require surgery.

boly

[Rog]

I have stated this before, and I think it's still true. It's not whether Gillaspie gets a lot of at bats or not; it's that they need to come against right-handed pitching. Conor is as bad as Denard against southpaws. Actually, even worse.

Conor's career OPS against southpaws is .523. We're down on Brandon Belt even though last season his slugging percentage (even for a guy who is limited in home runs by his home park) was only 49 points lower than Conor's career OPS against lefties.

His homer against Aroldis Chapman notwithstanding, Conor is awful against southpaws. He's not great against righties either, but he's decent for a bench player.

[donk33]

dk...this post says Hwang...so lets give the guy a tip of the cap...great set of numbers so far in todays' game and it is still going on....

[donk33]

Mar 25, 2017 16:01:58 GMT -5 klaiggeb said:

Problem with your logic, Don is that I have YET to hear a pitcher, either current of former Giant berate Buster's ability to call and manage a game.


They rave about him.

boly

dk...Posey is "the teacher's pet" and the "face" of the franchise...guys aren't going to have much to say about him...however, I have heard a pitcher say that Posey just puts signs down until you find one you like....Affeldt said that Posey had trouble catching his curve so he never called for it....management continued to say that they had to get Posey and the pitchers on "the same page"....and if you look at body language, pitchers have gotten pissed when Posey keeps calling for the "wrong" pitch....in their opinion....

[Rog]

The pitchers and catchers meet before games and go over scouting reports. I would assume they talk about how they will pitch hitters. If I were a pitcher, unless I had a specific reason, I would probably go with Buster's choice, since he's smarter than most of them and he's looking at the batter in the box for clues.

Most catchers seem to get shaken off more than one would think. On the other hand, the pitcher may have four or five pitches to choose from, plus four different locations. That's a lot of choices.

[garyd4sf]

The Giants need power at 3B and LF and especially off the bench. Some of the best power hitters in Spring training were Hwang, Marrero, and Parker. I think the Giants need to keep 2 of those 3. Parker has LF now with the Williamson injury and not having options. If sent down he is claimed. That leaves Hwang or Marrero. Hwang has more adaptability in field position, and better potential for higher batting averages, so he is the likely pick IMO. Hwang isn't a bad fielder either at 3B.

This team needs more pop particularly in road matches. I'm encouraged so far by the power shown in Spring training. Gap power AND homers. Too bad Morse went down, he was squaring up on every at bat. But his deal is to recover in AAA ball and then possibly returning.

[klaiggeb]

Welcome to the board, Gary.

I agree that we need to keep at least 2 of those guys, and personally, I'm sad that Morse went down.

He's a great clubhouse guy, and back in 2014, he proved what a clutch hitter he was.

boly

[Rog]

This team needs more pop particularly in road matches.


Rog -- See, Gary recognizes how tough it is to hit for power at AT&T. It's easier to hit singles and triples, but it's significantly harder to hit home runs.




Read more: sfgiantsmessageboard.proboards.com/thread/3777/hwang?page=2#ixzz4cfo6ptBV

[Rog]

The Giants need power at 3B and LF and especially off the bench. Some of the best power hitters in Spring training were Hwang, Marrero, and Parker. I think the Giants need to keep 2 of those 3.


Rog -- I think they need to keep all three. If Nunez or Hwang could start in left field, I would agree with the number two.

Speaking of Parker, his .263/.876 in spring training would be MORE than enough for the regular season. But Jarrett isn't going to hit .263 during the regular season.

I heard today that Jarrett hit just .108 against southpaws last season. He did hit them well in 2015, but basically, he's a platoon player at best. What the Giants need is for Nunez to play center field and Marrero to play left field against southpaws.

Read more: sfgiantsmessageboard.proboards.com/thread/3777/hwang?page=2#ixzz4cfqu28Hn

[Rog]

Also heard today that when someone asked why the Giants wouldn't win it all, the answer that came back was, "Have you seen their outfield?"

[Rog]

Tough decisions coming. Going to the title of this thread, other than possibly giving him some time to adjust to American culture, how does one tell Hwang that he has to go to Sacramento? He's had a wonderful spring. Marrero seems to have done enough to make it. Hill hasn't done as much, but he close out Arizona with a flourish, and he's coming off a decent bounce-back season after two down years in 2014 and 2015.

Then of course there are the pitcher battle and the question of 12 pitchers or 13. And at stake in each of these decisions is the possibility of losing players who don't have options. And problems such as, Marrero has shown he deserves a shot, but the Giants already have three guys who can play first base, and while Chris can play a little left field, he can't play center field, when what the Giants need most is a right-handed-hitting version of Gregor Blanco.

So, what to do?

First of all, find some way to get by with 12 pitchers. There are simply too many position players to carry a huge bullpen.


Second, realize Hwang and Marrero have done enough to make the squad and that Gillaspie is the only left-handed hitter off the bench.

Third, that leaves roster spot, and the Giants desperately need to reserve that for a right-handed hitting center fielder. Too bad they haven't worked Nunez at the position, but nothing can be done about that now -- except, of course, for having him take fly balls IMMEDIATELY.

The Giants have three ways to approach this last situation: Keep good field, no hit Gorky Hernandez. Hope Justin Ruggiano, who has a history of hitting southpaws hard, can play center field well enough to be the backup/short side platoon guy there. Find a guy on the waiver wire or trade for that backup right-hand hitting center fielder.

So Hill is out unless he'll go to Sacramento. For now at least, Tomlinson -- who hasn't really done anything wrong but still has options -- goes to the state capitol as well. Fortunately Morse has already said he's going to Sacto.

Which leaves the pitching staff. Will Smith is out, opening up a bullpen spot. The toughest question is, what to do with Matt Cain? Personally, I'd sit down for a heart-to-heart. Let him know the options, including Sacramento (which would be solely his choice) and/or the bullpen.

I personally would install Blach as the fifth starter and put Matt in the bullpen. I'd love to have him go to Sacramento, but I'd keep him up if necessary. Let's assume that's the case.

Neil Ramirez is easy. He deserves to make the team, but he has an option remaining. Albert Suarez and Corey Gearrin aren't easy because they don't have an option.

Melancon, Law, Strickland, Okert and Kontos take up the first five bullpen slots. If Cain stays, that leaves only one spot. I'd give it to Gearrin and hope Suarez wouldn't get claimed and would report to Sacramento. If Cain goes to Sacramento, that would leave room for both Gearrin and Suarez.

What I think the Giants will do is start Matt and send Blach back to Sacramento, where he and Tyler Beede can battle for the fifth starter slot after Cain loses it. That allows them to keep both Gearrin and Suarez.

I really don't see how the Giants are going to be able to keep 13 pitchers this time. If they keep a dozen, they still don't have room for Hill IMO.

[klaiggeb]

I said this in another post: We have 4 starters who LIKELY will pitch 200+ innings.

Not like last year when we had only 3, and the other 2 were lucky to go 5.

Those 2 over burdened the pen because it left no room for error with the big 3.

But 4, 200+ guys. That's a whole new cow.

Now, a 13 man deep staff is no longer a necessity.

Other than that, I like your logic, Rog, except for one thing; ya'all keep touting Nunez in LF. Not gonna happen. I think there's a greater likely-hood of him being traded.

boly

[Islandboagie]

Boly- ya'all keep touting Nunez in LF. Not gonna happen.

Boagie- With the outfield depth being a weakness and the other 2 third basemen having very solid springs I would say the possibility that Nunez see significant time in the outfield is certainly there.

[Rog]

Why don't we think Nunez in left field is a possibility?

I admit the Giants haven't shown an inclination toward it, so maybe Eduardo just isn't an outfielder. But I'd surely try.

The outfield situation is perilous. Any injury there would make an already below-par outfield a huge concern. And it's not like Pence and Span have been the healthiest outfielders the past two seasons.

No one seems to be acknowledging this, but what the Giants truly need is two right-handed hitting outfielders to platoon in center and left fields.

If I haven't shown bad a hitter Span has been against lefties the past four seasons, we're just not paying attention. That doesn't mean he can't have the odd good season against southpaws, but the odds certainly don't favor it.

And then there's Parker. Jarrett hit southpaws quite well in his 2015 Giants trial, but I think his true colors came out last season when he hit a robust .108 against southpaws.

So the Giants are starting two outfielders who had .566 and .390 OPS against southpaws last season. With three other left-handed hitters in the starting lineup, you don't think they're sitting ducks for lefties?

The Giants look pretty good everywhere else. Good players and nice depth. But the outfield is at best a concern and at worst a disaster.

Is whether Cain gets a brief shot instead of the more deserving Ty Blach worthy of some concern? Well, as long as the concern isn't too grave and the Giants don't give Matt too long a leash, kind of a concern.

But the outfield? If we're not only concerned but worried, I think we're being negilgent. Remember, I'm a guy who is concerned but not all that often worried. But I'm worried about the outfield.

Let me ask us this question: Which major league outfield would we LESS rather have than the Giants'? I doubt we'll e running out of cyberspace on that one.

[klaiggeb]

The Giants haven't even run him out there to practice.

Why would we believe that's going to change?

What they've done is play Marrero and Hwang out there.

It's obvious to me that Bochy want's Nunez at 3B

boly

[Islandboagie]

Rog- No one seems to be acknowledging this, but what the Giants truly need is two right-handed hitting outfielders to platoon in center and left fields.

Boagie- I understand the logic behind it, but you're failing to recognize the fact that our leadoff hitter shouldn't be in a platoon situation. That's a very crucial place in the batting order and a bench player shouldn't be expected to set the table for our entire offense. Do we have anyone that could do it? No. Gorkys Hernandez is really the only one that is capable of being a good center fielder, and obviously he can't leadoff.

There's one guy that could possibly leadoff and play the outfield, and that's Angel Pagan. Not sure how good of a center fielder he is anymore, but I imagine he couldn't be worse than Span.

Steven Duggar could fit that role in my opinion, but he's still unproven.

[Rog]

Boagie, some excellent comments here, right down to Duggar's being a strong possibility for the future. A minor issue with him as a leadoff man is that despite his speed, he hasn't yet learned to steal bases efficiently.

Going with Pagan, the Giants have been identified as a team with an interest in him, although since Andrew Baggerly wrote that it wasn't true, it probably wasn't. A guy who might have filled the bill, Peter Bourjos, was just traded to the Rays, so the Giants missed out on him. They could presumably have signed Austin Jackson to a minor league contract, but they didn't, and Jackson will be a backup outfielder for the Indians. I liked Aaron Hicks a year ago, but he was traded to the Yankees and is no longer available. Pagan probably isn't a good enough center fielder any more, and he truly isn't as good as Span IMO. Denard had a tough first half defensively, but he righted the ship in the second half and finished as a satisfactory center fielder IMO.

So should the Giants platoon Span and have another leadoff hitter when he's out? Personally, I'd go with Nunez. In fact, I wish the Giants had tried Eduard in center so that he might have been available for a platoon there. Gorkys Hernandez is plenty good enough defensively to platoon with Denard, but he's light of bat. If he could hit enough, he could lead off.

The Giants could use platoons in both center and left. Maybe Marrero is a good enough defender to platoon in left. He hit very, very well in the spring. And perhaps Ruggiano could handle center, although it appears to me in the brief time I've seen him that he's likely a bit marginal defensively at the position, even though he's played it a lot throughout his career. I believe he's 35 now.

Ruggiano could handle left, and he certainly has solved southpaws throughout his career. But I'm not at all sure he will make the roster. The only way I would choose him would be if he IS able to platoon in center.

I suspect the Giants would be open to a trade for a backup center fielder right now, and before the trade deadline we might possibly see Nunez go for an outfielder. Maybe Hwang will be able to play left field, if not Nunez.

At least there are possibilities, but as things stand at this moment, the outfield should be a significant concern. The starters are made up of a guy who has missed half the past two seasons, an injury-prone platoon player, and a young platoon player trying to show he belongs. The backups are (surprise, surprise) even worse. Good field, no hit or good hit, no field.

[Rog]

Austin Slater is another outfielder who might be able to help out before too long. He has the added advantage of being able to play second base as well and in fact has played there about as much as in the outfield. Slater is a sleeper, and Duggar is a digger.