|
|
Post by klaiggeb on Oct 12, 2013 16:11:57 GMT -5
I would say Matt was a little lucky in the 2nd half and didn't pitch as well as the 2.36 ERA would indicate, but his walk and home run numbers don't point to a lack of command. If anything, his strikeouts of .76 per innning compared to .86 over his career point to possibly having a little less stuff.
---boly says---
Bumgarner is still very young, and is still learning, and more importantly, improving.
He's not... YET the established starter/star that Cain is, but he'll be there soon.
The quantity of HRs Matt gave up, I believe, is a point of concern.
My HOPE is that the 'experts' are right; his body was just tired from all of the innings.
To an old timer like me, when the stars routinely pitched 250+ innings EVERY year, that sounds fishy...
Then again, no one pitches complete games any more, either, so who knows.
But we NEED, no make that DESPERATELY need Cain to return to his pre 2013 form.
Cain, Bumgarner... and then, what, 3 days of rain?
Sorry, but at 37, though I love the guy, I'm not sure Vogey's a number 3.
Sabean has already stated that Lincecum is a #4.
We NEED at least 2 quality starters. One is an absolute must!
Gaudin?
Petit?
Nice guys, but they're swing men at best. 2014's version of Guillermo Mota, nothing more.
That's why I want Price so badly that I'd give up a guy like Crick (sp?) and then some to get him.
boly
|
|
|
|
Post by sharksrog on Oct 13, 2013 8:30:50 GMT -5
Boly -- Bumgarner is still very young, and is still learning, and more importantly, improving. He's not... YET the established starter/star that Cain is, but he'll be there soon. Rog -- He may already have gotten there. Four times in his 8-year career, Matt Cain has posted an ERA below 3.65. Madison Bumgarner has done so in each of his four seasons. Over the past four seasons, Bumgarner has a lower ERA than Cain (although it's very close). Cain also had an outstanding season in 2010, before Bumgarner came to the big leagues to stay. Read more: sfgiantsmessageboard.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=general&thread=2010&page=2#15834#ixzz2hbkfw08j |
|
|
|
Post by sharksrog on Oct 13, 2013 8:42:02 GMT -5
Boly -- My HOPE is that the 'experts' are right; his body was just tired from all of the innings. Rog -- I think he was simply "off." Matt was horrible in April and May, but beginning with his 2nd start in June, was a very good pitcher. Beginning with that 2nd start in June, Cain only once yielded more than 3 runs in a start. Over his last 19 starts of the season, he walked only 31 batters. In his final 21 starts, he yielded just 10 home runs. That came on the heels of walking 24 in his first 11 starts and yielding 13 homers in his first 9 outings. Read more: sfgiantsmessageboard.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=general&thread=2010&page=2#ixzz2hbnSWWqQ |
|
|
|
Post by sharksrog on Oct 13, 2013 8:46:07 GMT -5
We NEED at least 2 quality starters. One is an absolute must!
Gaudin?
Petit?
Boly -- Nice guys, but they're swing men at best. 2014's version of Guillermo Mota, nothing more.
Rog -- Chad Gaudin posted a 3.06 ERA in 97 innings last season. The best Mota did as a Giant was 3.81 over 80 innings in 2011.
action=display&board=general&thread=2010&page=2#ixzz2hbqFZDY4
|
|
|
|
Post by sharksrog on Oct 13, 2013 8:53:43 GMT -5
Boly -- I want Price so badly that I'd give up a guy like Crick (sp?) and then some to get him. Rog -- If the "then some" were quite good, it would likely get the job done. As tempting as that is, I wouldn't make the deal. Five reasons: . The Giants' future is based on the young players they already have plus the very young arms on the farm. . The Giants could lose Price to free agency after just two seasons with the team. . Price is 28, while the arms of the future are late teens to early 20's. . Price will cost a ton of money if the Giants re-sign him, while the young arms would be very cost-effective while under team control for the next several seasons. . The young arms could be arriving as soon as 2014. Heath Hembree has already arrived. Read more: sfgiantsmessageboard.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=general&thread=2010&page=2#ixzz2hbrDYpZf |
|
|
|
Post by sharksrog on Oct 13, 2013 8:56:30 GMT -5
Intriguing that we sometimes criticize Bruce Bochy for not giving the youngsters a shot, but might ourselves be willing to trade quality youngsters for a veteran, even before those youngsters get a chance to make the major leagues.
On the other hand, Price is a young and very skilled veteran.
|
|
|
|
Post by rxmeister on Oct 13, 2013 9:18:34 GMT -5
I mentioned the package I said might land Price, but let me be clear that I don't recommend the Giants make that trade! Anyone remember the excitement we had with Cain's first start, Timmy's first start and Bumgarner's? I'd like to experience that again multiple times. Lincecum's first start especially, as I remember fans of other teams telling us how lucky we were. And of course they were right, as he won two Cy Young's and eventually two World Series. The Giants have a lot of pitching prospects and I can see them trading one or two, but I would take a lesser player before I give up any of the top ones.
|
|
|
|
Post by klaiggeb on Oct 13, 2013 9:51:39 GMT -5
Rog -- Chad Gaudin posted a 3.06 ERA in 97 innings last season. The best Mota did as a Giant was 3.81 over 80 innings in 2011.
---boly says---
Rog, please. You're comparing ONE season by Gaudin to ONE season by Mota?
Look at Gaudin's previous 3 years:
5.5
6.4
4.5 ERA's.
Sorry, but that is one SORRY track record.
Take out MOta's suspened 2012, and you've got
3.4
4.3
3.8
I'll take Mota.
boly
|
|
|
|
Post by sharksrog on Oct 13, 2013 10:18:54 GMT -5
Rog -- Chad Gaudin posted a 3.06 ERA in 97 innings last season. The best Mota did as a Giant was 3.81 over 80 innings in 2011. ---boly says--- Rog, please. You're comparing ONE season by Gaudin to ONE season by Mota? Look at Gaudin's previous 3 years: 5.5 6.4 4.5 ERA's. Sorry, but that is one SORRY track record. Take out MOta's suspened 2012, and you've got 3.4 4.3 3.8 I'll take Mota. Rog -- I was referring only to their time with the Giants. Clearly Guillermo has had the better overall career. That said, the only team he pitched well for was the Dodgers, so I hated that part.  Read more: sfgiantsmessageboard.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=general&thread=2010&page=2#15856#ixzz2hcDyQIfw |
|
